November 27, 2005
Notre Dame looks like Fiesta Bowl lock
Notre Dame needed a late rally to beat Stanford 38-31, but by all accounts, the Irish win all but ensures that they will be playing in a BCS game this season. With the win, Notre Dame became BCS eligible. Only a fool would pass on taking the Irish as a BCS at-large team, and the guys at the Fiesta Bowl aren't fools. That said, the Fiesta Bowl isn't tipping it's hand just yet.
"Despite all the projections and everyone writing things in pen and ink, we're really in a holding pattern until all the games are played," Fiesta Bowl executive director John Junker said. "Notre Dame is certainly a great story this year."
Yeah, right.
The only question is, who will Notre Dame face? That has brought out the boo birds with repeated shots at how Notre Dame is over-rated.
Fellas, forget the good/bad debate about a 9-2 Notre Dame team. Yeah, I know - Notre Dame has only beaten three teams that are even bowl eligible (Navy, Michigan, and BYU). I know, but there's no way the Fiesta passes on the Notre Dame ticket sales, hype, and television ratings. The Irish are the figurative pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, and after last year's less than marquee Pitt-Utah matchup, the Fiesta is going to cash in big this year.
That said, with Notre Dame as an at-large BCS team, at least one higher ranked BCS eligible team is going to be excluded - Oregon, Ohio State (and potentially Virginia Tech and LSU) all come to mind.
Note to the BCS haters: Colorado, Georgia, UCLA and Florida State are the teams to root forif you want BCS chaos. Colorado & FSU would be BCS bound with four losses, Texas would be the at-large as would, and the National Championship in the Rose Bowl would be anybody's guess. LSU, Va Tech, Notre Dame, Ohio State, & Oregon would all potentially be throwing fits in their non-BCS bowls, because losses wouldn't raise anybody up to #1 or #2. You could actually end up with all of the top teams losing and Southern Cal & Texas still being #1 and #2. Chaos, sweet chaos.
If this weekend's game go as expected and the favorites win out, then Ohio State is probably in the Fiesta and 10-1 Oregon -whose only loss is to USC - is the odd man out.
Or to hear The Sporting News' Tom Dienhart tell it:
Anyone else feel Sasquatch has a better chance of finding the Loch Ness Monster in the Bermuda Triangle than Oregon does of receiving an at-large BCS bid?
A Notre Dame - Ohio State matchup would bring huge national ratings. Despite the Pac10's posturing, an Oregon - UND game couldn't touch the television numbers that the Buckeyes would bring.
Comments:
gfman said:
posted on November 27, 2005 6:06 PM — 71.12.14.156 — link — abuse?
WOW ND sucks up to the BCS again. I will love to see them agaisnt Oregon or Ohio State. The thing is that Oregon should have the at large and not ND. ND has lost 2 games Oregon has lost 1, fair is fair. I hate u stupid irish, yall get that fat coach int here and win a lot of close games. WAY TO GO CHEATERS
Bill Rocklin said:
posted on November 27, 2005 6:39 PM — 67.176.99.93 — link — abuse?
The Irish are indeed the surprise of the season by any measure. This is a team which was projected to win no more than 3-4 game by all the 'experts' in the media. Weiss deserves COY by any measure - and the best is yet to come in the next 2-3 years.
It will be Irish-Buckeyes in the Fiesta unless UCLA spoils the party in which case - we'll see PSU-Irish in the Orange instead. PSU is the other shocking team of the year.
Irish haters - eat your hearts out.
posted on November 27, 2005 6:46 PM — link — abuse?Kevin Donahue said:
Ghost - my hypothetical had VaTech and LSU getting upsetted, and then getting the shaft as at-large. Obviously VaTech and LSU are favored for their title games, but stranger things have happened.
Bob Sharer said:
posted on November 27, 2005 8:24 PM — 64.12.116.139 — link — abuse?
Notre Dame is more than deserving of an at large BCS bowl, they have blown out most teams they played this year. And bye the way USC was lucky........very lucky to escape South Bend unscathed. All the critics can stick it.
IrishJT said:
posted on November 27, 2005 8:59 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
I find it remarkable, and a bit unbelievable, that many of you believe that Notre Dame has "cheated" played a "weak schedule" and are somehow the darlings of the media. There is not a team in the country that brings in ticket sales and ratings like the Irish. That is because we do it the hard way...high, uncompromising standards, a quality program and a tradition that goes back longer than most of your programs...period!! You don't have to love us, but your hatred is maniacal, ridiculous and indicative of your inability to look at college football objectively. Do any of you think that USC or Mich.St. would like to play ND again?? Not a chance. Stop hatin'!!
Rev. M.C. Manning said:
posted on November 27, 2005 10:05 PM — 24.20.249.166 — link — abuse?
Looks like Oregon is going to have to grab it's ankles like it did a few years ago. Thanks again BCS....or should we say just plain BS? It should be about the love of the game....not the love of the $$$$$$ I'd rather see two deserving teams go at it head to head then to see one get led off to slaughter, just because it's a cash cow.
boifromtroy said:
posted on November 27, 2005 11:14 PM — 68.233.235.234 — link — abuse?
Why does everyone seem to think ND-Ohio State is a game everyone in the nation would want to watch?
Sounds more of a regional interest to me...no more exciting than, say, Virginia Tech-West Virginia.
lsutiger08 said:
posted on November 27, 2005 11:24 PM — 67.142.130.15 — link — abuse?
My gripe isn't so much ND as it is with the system. But come on! How can you say that the Irish didn't cakewalk their way to through those 9 wins. Let's see... only 4 games against bowl eligible teams and only 3 wins against them. Wins over Pac-10 pasties Washington and Stanford. And puhleese...Syracuse,Pitt? Would the BCS really take ND over either one-loss Oregon or 2-loss Ohio St.? What about potentially a 2-loss LSU or VT?
Dan Isaacs said:
posted on November 27, 2005 11:56 PM — 69.134.153.126 — link — abuse?
Oregon got BLOWN out AT HOME. They have a backup QB. No compelling players.
Ohio State lost by a total of 10 points to the 2nd and 3rd ranked BCS teams. Have one of the top QBs in the NCAA. And have a number of compelling players (Ted Ginn, AJ Hawk, Troy Smith...)
Its difficult to believe that LSU loses to GA and gets an at large. No way VT loses to FSU and gets an At-Large bid (not after getting destroyed by Miami. Ohio State/ND is the marquee matchup, and the one ou'll see, unless Texas or USC fails to win out.
posted on November 28, 2005 12:05 AM — 68.35.231.61 — link — abuse?
It would seem to me that Notre Dame has a tremendous amount of influence on who they play in the Fiesta Bowl. If the Irish make it clear that they don't want to play Ohio State (can you blame them?) wouldn't the Fiesta want to set up a match-up that would be attractive on both coasts and to Notre Dame (ie-ND vs. Oregon). If I were the Irish I'd take Ohio State, They don't want a repeat of this Pac-10 vs. ND beating do they?
jj said:
posted on November 28, 2005 2:36 AM — 216.239.166.114 — link — abuse?
To "": those are great reasons why Notre Dame is a great school. I'd send my kid there.
Unfortunately they lost two games this year. Oregon only lost one.
If your best argument is that ND has lots of money and tons of rich fans, then perhaps you guys should just buy yourselves a big gold trophy and pat yourselves on the back about how great you are. Leave football to the teams that earn it on the field.
JD Arney said:
posted on November 28, 2005 3:45 AM — 69.211.140.169 — link — abuse?
"Why does everyone seem to think ND-Ohio State is a game everyone in the nation would want to watch?
Sounds more of a regional interest to me...no more exciting than, say, Virginia Tech-West Virginia."
Are you serious? Notre Dame has fans all over the country. I won't even bother defending tOSU's national reach since I'm a homer, but comparing Notre Dame to anything having to do with Virginia Tech or West Virginia is ridiculous.
duckman said:
posted on November 28, 2005 6:02 AM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
This one goes out to IrishJT,
If you are to challenge what most people believe as fact than you should bring facts and numbers and not foundationless accusations. The Irish did play a weak schedule and still managed to lose two games. They lost to Mich. State who is 5-6. I watched the Irish struggle last weak against a team that lost to U.C. Davis and you want respect because you almost beat USC while coming of a bye weak and playing a home game. If you want to make people think differently than tell us why. I don’t think you can justify the unjust. I do think that you will attack my team (the Ducks) because the numbers say they played a weak schedule as well. I disagree with that but even if you believe they did the Ducks only lost one game compared to the Irish losing two and they don’t play in a BCS conference, the Ducks do. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out that the Irish don’t belong in the BCS games. I am not saying that the Irish are a bad team. They have talent and make a good story in the news papers. They are also taking up space in the BCS race that a deserving team should be in. You are right about one thing, the ticket sales and ratings would be huge and the BCS dose not care if ND get blow out and embarrassed (once again) so long as you watch, but that is not what the bowl system is suppose to be about. They are not looking at teams from the stand point of how good are they. They are looking at it from a stand point of how much money can they make us, and that’s just wrong and everyone seems to be O.K. with this. The BCS is ruining college football. So Irish JT, (or anyone) tell me why I am wrong. I am dying to know the truth!! P.S. If the Irish win the Fiesta bowl(know matter who they play) I will stop posting.-P.P.S. GO DUCKS!!!
JOHN ARNT said:
posted on November 28, 2005 6:03 AM — 67.9.37.151 — link — abuse?
Mark May an ESPN Analyst?
WHY WOULD YOU THINK THAT THE OREGON DUCKS SHOULD GO TO THE FIESTA INSTEAD OF NOTRE DAME? MARK I CHECKED THE RANKINGS IN THE TOP 20 AND THIS IS WHAT I CAME UP WITH.
POSSIBLY YOU SHOULD CHECK THE FACTS THE NEXT TIME YOU _____ OFF 50% OF COLLEGE FOOTBALL FANS....
1. USC 2 RANKED TEAMS
2. TEXAS 2 RANKED TEAMS
3. LSU 3 RANKED TEAMS
4. PENN STATE -2 RANKED TEAMS,
5 .VIRGINIA TECH 3 RANKED TEAMS
6. OHIO STATE 3 RANKED TEAMS
7. NOTRE DAME 2 RANKED TEAMS
8. OREGON DUCKS 1 RANKED TEAM
9. AUBURN TIGERS- 3 RANKED TEAMS
10.MIAMI - 1 RANKED TEAM WITHJOHN ARNT
Larry said:
posted on November 28, 2005 9:09 AM — 155.8.89.2 — link — abuse?
Notre Dame is the Dallas Cowboys of college football; either you love them or hate them. Personally their story this year has been a great one but honestly, when the high point of your season is losing to USC by one point, is that a good enough reason to put you into a BCS bowl over a one loss team? Throw out the woulda/coulda/shouldas and Notre Dame had a good year; not great but good. The bottom line is that at 9-2 and losing to the same team that Oregon did (regardless of the score) doesn't entitle you to take their BCS slot. Now, that is the view in the strict college football purist sense and we know that doesn't count for anything in college football politics! The national media slobbers all over Notre Dame and will convince the Fiesta Bowl reps. to take ND over the Ducks, no doubt about it and that's a shame because Oregon (my opinion) is a more deserving team then ND (or Ohio St. for that matter). What I would like to see is Phil Knight weigh in on the Ducks side and see if he can't do a little convincing of his own; don't overestimate the power of Nike!!
Pat Lu said:
posted on November 28, 2005 9:36 AM — 24.105.169.66 — link — abuse?
Notre Dame should not be considered as at large team. It is actually not. It is locked on when ranked in top 12 regardless of the record. This is the biggest defect of current BCS system. Irish got the ranking based only on close loss to an overrated #1 team.
Brian said:
posted on November 28, 2005 10:58 AM — 67.110.67.194 — link — abuse?
I don't think Notre Dame deserves to be in the BCS (after all, I'm the boo bird Kevin linked to) and think they kind of suck, but I must admit I'll be glued to my TV if they play Ohio State in the Fiesta Bowl and so will a lot of the "casual" sports fans. I hate the way the system works and think it needs to be changed, but if I'm the Fiesta Bowl selection committee I'm wetting my pants over that match up and the TV ratings it's going to bring.
Hippster in KC said:
posted on November 28, 2005 11:32 AM — 12.4.181.2 — link — abuse?
I don't get why ND would be scared of playing Ohio State. Just because they have a good defense? Somehow I don't think Weis is too worried about that.
ND doesn't schedule Montana State and then bitch that they don't get national love. I don't see ND ducking Ohio State or anyone else.
And regarding the ridiculous debacle in 2001, coach Bob is right where he belongs. That's not happening with Weis.
Jack said:
posted on November 28, 2005 1:33 PM — 192.207.114.20 — link — abuse?
In Oregon's 10 wins, they have an average margin of victory of 17.1. They have played against two Top 25 teams (USC & Fresno State). They lost to USC and beat Fresno State. They have played ten Division 1 teams and one Division 1-AA team (Montana).
In Notre Dame's 9 wins, they have an average margin of victory of 19.4 They have played agasint two Top 25 teams (USC & Michigan). They lost to USC and beat Michigan. They have played 11 Division 1 teams.
So don't talk to me about strength of schedule. I don't see ND scheduling anybody from the Big Sky conference. By all accounts, ND's schedule looked brutal during the summer. It's not ND's fault those teams tanked.
Fix your schedule. If you want respect from the nation, then travel across the nation to play the big name teams (ACC, SEC, Big 10).
Fix your uniforms. If you want respect from the nation, then quit looking like a bunch of clowns. Phil Knight is destroying your image, pun intended.
Fix your argument. If you want somebody to blame, don't blame Notre Dame. Blame the BCS for these lame conference tie-in's. The Big East should not be part of the BCS. They should be eligible for At-Large but that is it.
Finally, the BCS has a Presidential Oversight Committee which was set up in 2003 to "to provide leadership and direction for the BCS." The Chair of the BCS Presidential Oversight Committee is none other than Mr. David Frohnmayer. Who is Mr. Frohnmayer you ask? Well, during the day he just happens to be the President of the University of Oregon and has been since 1994.
BCS Presidential Oversight Committee
Chair - David Frohnmayer, President (Oregon)
David Hardesty, President (West Virginia)
Robert Khayat, Chancellor (Ole Miss)
Rev. John Jenkins, President (Notre Dame)
Harvey Perlman, Chancellor (Nebraska)
Graham Spanier, President (Penn State)
Stephen Weber, President (San Diego State)So Ducks fans think their team is getting the shaft? Don't blame Notre Dame, blame your own President. If the system needed tweaking, he was/is in a position to do so, but hasn't.
Bryan said:
posted on November 28, 2005 2:03 PM — 152.50.0.194 — link — abuse?
Being a purist, I think Oregon should get a BCS bid, but I know they will not. I understand money drives college football and ND sells tickets. I get that. I just hate the fact that ND is living off a game they LOST.
Let's face it. ND goes 9-2 on a given year, they are going to a BCS game, period. No other team has that "privlidge".
Think about this.... ND is good enough for the BCS folks at 9-2, yet Oregon is not at 10-1. So, the BCS bowl execs. are basically saying Oregon must go 11-0 in order to secure a BCS game, yet ND must merely aspire to 9-2.
boifromtroy said:
posted on November 28, 2005 2:12 PM — 66.134.232.250 — link — abuse?
The argument for Notre Dame being included is because of the national fan base.
The question is... Should we set up a regional matchup, or one with national implications?
Oregon or Auburn would be better picks than tOSU in this regard.
posted on November 28, 2005 2:27 PM — link — abuse?
Boi - I think you're underestimating the national appeal of Ohio State. Great alumni support coast-to-coast, plus they have that "love/hate" factor where a lot of people watch just to see them win/lose. I can guarantee you they'll draw ratings in Oregon for just that reason. ;)
posted on November 28, 2005 3:35 PM — 168.166.54.11 — link — abuse?
You can argue that the annual Notre Dame/Michigan battle is a "regional matchup" as well, but TV ratings tell a different story. It's matchup of two traditional powers, storied traditions, name-brand programs, etc. Ohio State has a national following and reputation that far surpasses Oregon's. I'm not saying that it's the perfect matchup, but the Fiesta Bowl and the TV people could do a lot worse.
Dan said:
posted on November 28, 2005 4:24 PM — 216.0.191.2 — link — abuse?
How can anyone rightfully say ND belongs as an automatic in the BCS? They played 4 ranked teams, lost to one unranked, and played 6 schools who didnt even have a winning season! THe real question should be who is OSU going to face, Oregon or ND. From there the nod would still favor a Bucks and Ducks Fiesta! But doing its annual dance, the BCS will sell out to the dollars and justice will be undone. Playoffs are the only real solution!
Fan of the Game said:
posted on November 28, 2005 4:56 PM — 12.43.234.14 — link — abuse?
So why is everyone arguing? It is more than apparent to everyone here that a teams ability to fill seats and gross the largest television audiences are a key factor in deciding who goes to the BCS bowls. ND has a good team, no doubt. Oregon has a good team as well. Even if Oregon seems to be the better (and they do), ND has a much larger fan base due mainly in part to a rich football history and NBC (Notre dame Broadcasting Channel). The BCS has never been about "what's fair" or "who deserves what", but about the money. Personally I feel that the larger conferences (Big12, PAC10, SEC and ACC) should go the way of the Big10(eleven teams, go figure). Quit playing conference title games and help to ensure more contreversy. By doing this, a conference will never appear as weak as it may actually be. It has worked for the Big10 (did I mention there are 11 teams). Independent teams can ensure themselves of at least some recognition by playing games against conferences like the Big10(again, 11 teams) Undoubtedly, there are some good teams there, but even when they have off years, they will be hyped up so they will appear better than they are. Hype + large fan bases = Bowl games. It is really that simple.
Daniel C. said:
posted on November 28, 2005 6:18 PM — 71.161.48.86 — link — abuse?
As an Irish fan I can honestly say I love all the hate we get. Hate me!! Please!! Its all based on opinion. The fact is the Pac 10 is WEAK, yes USC is awesome. Nobody can say otherwise but who else, UCLA? Give me a break the only real team they play is USC. Even UT, the only real team they have played is OSU, and that was by no means a blow out. And to bash Weis is one of the stupidest things I have ever been a witness to. He has taken a mediocre team and put belief back in them, there was almost no recruting done because well lets see..... he was WINNING THE SUPER BOWL!! He will put ND back where they belong, earning your hate, beating your team, winning the title and I love him for it!! The four horsemen are saddling up, and they will ride again.
Brad said:
posted on November 28, 2005 6:28 PM — 65.11.72.55 — link — abuse?
It's quite simple why Notre Dame vs. Ohio State in the Fiesta makes sense. Big money follows big time tradition. Both schools foster more than 100 years of strong tradition and although the schools may seem geographically a regional match up they don't play each other often. N.Dame will play Michigan, Purdue and Michigan St. almost annually, but they duck Ohio State having last played in a home/away series in 1995/1996 (OSU won both games). Comparing an ND/OSU match up like a VTech/W.Virg. game is nuts.
Some claimed the 1936 (I hope I have the year right) OSU/Notre Dame college game the greatest of all time prior to the Miami/OSU national title game of 2003.
The Fiesta Bowl representatives surely remember what school filled 65,000 seats in their stadium against Miami and still had 15,000-20,000 that just ventured to watch from the parking lot or a local bar.
Notre Dame/OSU will have a bigger TV audience than even USC/Texas, so tune in to watch another ESPN Instant Classic in Tempe.
Go Bucks!!duckman said:
posted on November 28, 2005 7:55 PM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
Jack;
Lets consider that you are correct and Oregon did play as weak of a schedule as ND. ND still lost two games. They lost to Mich. State who is 5-6 and struggled against Stanford. ND beat 2 teams that are bowl eligible and one of those was Navy(if you want to count that one go ahead). Oregon beat 3. Not much of an edge but it is still an edge. What are you going to post when they get blown out (once again) in a BCS game. The bottom line is that ND lost 2 games and Oregon only lost 1. The only thing that makes them a lock for a bowl game is money. Why even pretend to have a ranking system. Why not bid off the bowl games before the season even starts. I want to see a good game when I watch bowl games, not watch the Irish get walked on. P.S.GO DUCKS!!!
Tommie Trojan said:
posted on November 28, 2005 11:44 PM — 208.57.130.196 — link — abuse?
Lotta hate out there:
I feel all of your pain. First off, as a college football fan, I think that all of the teams are great. There are always at least ten very good teams. Why was the BCS limited to eight teams anyway? That was stupid! In the "old days" we had the Rose, Orange, Sugar, Cotton and the Fiesta Bowl moving into being a "Big Time Game". We've always had a "great eight" filling those previous four Bowl games throughout history. Why did the Cotton Bowl lose out on "BCS Status" anyway? We could have had ten teams gain BCS games. I beleive that all of the mentioned teams have played well enough to gain a berth!
I do not beleive in the "Conference Championship" games. I understand that a 7-4 team could "get lucky" on any Saturday - and upset a real BCS eligible team. That is BS! We play the whole season to determine who a conference champion ought to be. And, I don't think that a "Big East" team should get an automatic invite. Heck, the WAC, MAC, and Mountain West ought to get one also then. Nothing against West Virginia this year - they might deserve an invite regardless. But, that conference is real weak. Bowl games have always been about money. I liked the way it was in the old days though. I even liked the way the conferences were set up. Why did they get rid of the SWC? That was BS too!
As a lifelong Trojan fan - I have the utmost respect for Notre Dame! We love to play them every year! They are scary to us - every year. Nobody has kicked the crap out of USC more times than ND has. I root for every team we play. Notre Dame would probably be 10-1 had they not had to play USC. Likewise, Oregon would probably be undefeated. I will be rooting for the other four PAC-10 teams plus Notre Dame and Fresno State in their bowl games. Too bad I can't bring myself to root for Texas. But, after that game, I hope they real off another twelve in a row!
A solution might be to make the Cotton Bowl into a BCS game and offer two more deserving teams a BCS invite. Of course, even at that, there will always be controversy. But, I think that there are always at least ten teams that deserve to get the BCS payouts.Tommie Trojan
Skip said:
posted on November 29, 2005 4:01 AM — 140.180.160.20 — link — abuse?
Who ever said that the four BCS bowls were about rankings? If that's all that mattered, the top 8 ranked teams would get in. It's nice to complain about this sort of thing, but every BCS hater worth his salt knows that it's all about the money. I suppose whining about the same old thing over and over again never gets old for some people, though. I, for one, will love watching two storied programs play in a big-time bowl game, and I guarantee that whatever bowl ND gets into will be #2 behind the Rose in ratings.
And besides, how many people here would bet money on Oregon beating Notre Dame on a neutral field?
CWokk said:
posted on November 29, 2005 12:13 PM — 192.44.136.103 — link — abuse?
Let's see...
Houston 6-5 predictable weak team...YES
Montana 8-5 predicatble weak team...YES
Fresno St 8-3 respectable win, not usual patsy
USC 11-0 blown out by 32 at home
Stanford 5-6 played by both, so say what you will
Arizona St 6-5 decent, but not a football power
Washington 2-9 see Stanford above
Arizona 3-8 with one good game
Cal respectable win, 7-4 with high early praise
Wash St. 4-7, patsy beaten by last second FG
Oregon St. 5-6, another cake team in the Pac-10And in comparison...
Pitt 5-6, #23 when beaten by the Irish
Michigan 7-4, #3 when beaten by the Irish
Michigan St 5-6, #17 when beat Irish, peak #11
Washington 2-9, more on the line b/c of Ty on road
Purdue, 5-6, #22 when beaten by ND, peak #11
USC, 11-0, #1 when beat ND with :03 seconds left
BYU, 6-5, going to a bowl, decent team
Tenn 5-6, preseason #3, not Montana or Houston
Navy, proj 7-4, going to a bowl
Syracuse, 1-10, BCS conference team, but horrible
Stanford, 5-6, away w/ their bowl hopes on lineSo, to those who like to look at strength of schedule and say we cheat and that we have 2 losses and Oregon has one, that is fine. But, to be objective, don't just look at how the team finished but how and who they played during the season. That is the easiest way to look at who deserves it. Subjectively, Oregon has to face the facts that as long as the exist they will never have the football appeal of ND. Period.
Jeremy Collins said:
posted on November 29, 2005 3:14 PM — 167.239.196.254 — link — abuse?
CWOKK
your being to bias to make a good argument look at when you put the teams up there you ranked the ND opponents but not the Ducks
your opinon on this matter is no longer one I will look at
jomocs8 said:
posted on November 29, 2005 3:30 PM — 164.106.138.222 — link — abuse?
Why does everyone feel that ND is not deserving of a BCS bid? I hear people saying that they lost two games or their schedule is weak. If I recall they won those games when each team seemed to be doing fine and they lost those two games when each team (USC/Mich St.) were rolling. So what Mich St, Mich, Pur, Pitt, has fallen off. Notre Dame did what a lot of teams could not pull off and that was win all of their road games. Irish National Champs in '06
JJ said:
posted on November 29, 2005 3:58 PM — 216.239.176.15 — link — abuse?
> And besides, how many people here would bet
> money on Oregon beating Notre Dame on a neutral
> field?If by some miracle Oregon and Notre Dame both get into the Fiesta, you can BET THE HOUSE on Oregon! (Luckily for you and your tradition and history, etc., you'll never have to, and some other team will get to prove you're the doormat you really are.)
For the guy who says Oregon should come east: here's a thought --all of you who love ND so much, why not lobby your Athletic Director to schedule a home-and-away with Oregon? Because it'd be 2 wins for the Ducks, that's why!
Pac10Girl said:
posted on November 29, 2005 5:18 PM — 67.98.229.10 — link — abuse?
Since when did we stop caring about seeing a GOOD football game? I guess that the Fiesta Bowl organizers aren't concerned about a drop in ratings when everyone turns off their tv rather than see Ohio State blow the Irish out of the water. Let's face it, the Irish are going to get spanked. How do I know? Because I watched them almost lose to the more-than-pathetic Cardinal who failed to even score a touch down against Cal the week before (at home no less). It's not how you start the season; it's how you end it. I don't care who played a tougher schedule or more bowl eligible teams at this point, ND is just a mediocre football team, and I'm looking forward to turning off my TV on Jan 2.
Skip said:
posted on November 29, 2005 8:19 PM — 128.112.203.71 — link — abuse?
>>all of you who love ND so much, why not lobby your Athletic Director to schedule a home-and-away with Oregon?
ND already has a yearly game with that little school in Los Angeles that spanked Oregon by 32 this year. Why bother?
IrishJT said:
posted on November 29, 2005 8:58 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
Duck Fans, I feel sorry for you. I honestly do. My wife went to Auburn and last year felt that disrespect that so many of you tenuously mention. Being a Notre Dame grad myself, I am used to the dislike or resentment towards the Irish. That's fine. But I will say that playing Houston & Montana, losing by 5 touchdowns to USC, scraping by a now-unranked Fresno State simply does not make you a national powerhouse. Houston?? Montana??? You have now lost the right or ability to speak ill of any team's schedule unless it is in the context of "who's is the weakest?"
The PAC 10 is perenially the weakest BCS conference in the nation, competing now with the Big East. Sure Pitt, Purdue, MSU and Tennessee didn't perform to their normal standards...but how much of that was due to their encounter with the Irish? Even Mark May would have to agree that Notre Dame, year in and year out, has one of the toughest schedules in the country. You Duck fans that think 10-1 in the PAC 10, coupled with an out of conference schedule against Fresno St, Montana & Houston, is some great accomplishment is disingenuous at best, most likely intellectually dishonest, and one of the reasons why you won't go to a BCS bowl. Your body of work is weak. Auburn will tell you...a weak out of conference schedule cost them a trip to the Orange last year (The Citadel??). I guess the upside is that at least now the PAC 10 has something in common with the SEC. Go buy some Nikes and some coffee on your way to recycle your sandals and chew on that!!!
I wonder how the Citadel would match up against Montana?? Hmm.
I hate oregon said:
posted on November 29, 2005 9:54 PM — 129.74.202.27 — link — abuse?
the ducks beat a #17 Arizona State team and a #23 cal team. Congratulations. The Trojans scored 45 unanswered points on the Ducks. The Trojans scored 34 TOTAL points on the Irish. When it comes to strenght of schedule you can not blame the Irish. I mean honestly, I am glad that the AD at Oregon had the crystal ball to know that Montana and Houston would turn out to be better teams than Purdue, Tennesse and Pitt. If the Ducks were a respectable team like they say they are, they would have scheduled two BCS teams from the previous year like the Irish did instead of two games that the Notre Dame interhall football teams could win. Screw the Ducks, they are gonna lose to a terrible Colorado team in the Pacific Life Bowl.
locondfan11 said:
posted on November 30, 2005 12:58 AM — 69.209.75.15 — link — abuse?
THIS IS FOR EVERYONE OUT THERE WHO IS GIVING ALL THIS BS ABOUT WHY ND DOESNT BELONG!
AS MIKE GOLIC SAID DONT HATE THE PLAYER, HATE THE GAME. OTHER TEAMS VOTED ON THE SYSTEM AND THE REQUIREMENTS FOR NOTRE DAME TO MAKE A BCS GAME. THE SYSTEM IS CORRUPT- WEST VIRGINIA IS THE TEAM STEALING OREGONS SPOT.The Rock 11/29
I knew the Irish were all the way back when I sat next to a couple at dinner talking about naming their first son Brady and neither was a Domer. That doesn't happen when you're losing. It’s been a great year, a year of redemption for Notre Dame, its fans and college football.
Not great in the traditional Notre Dame sense of championships, but in bringing back the indefinable it that is Notre Dame football, the sense that magic could happen and should happen. And we came so close. Notre Dame has led in every game this year and in all but one by at least a touchdown. More impressively, the Irish have opened two touchdown or more leads in eight of eleven games and in most of those games the final score rarely told the full story of domination.
Even the Stanford game was a statistical mismatch, with Notre Dame rolling up a season high 663 yards, including 432 in the air to Stanford’s 336. Only mistakes kept the game close on the scoreboard and two of those mistakes, Quinn’s, were Favresque, mistakes of overconfidence. But when the Irish needed the final drive, I didn’t have that sinking pitted feeling of the past decade; in fact, I would have been surprised if we didn’t put it in the end zone. We wouldn’t have won that game last year.
Think about our offense the last eight years, cringe and then smile at how far we've come so fast. Here's what we have: A record breaking passer, two one thousand yard receivers, a one thousand yard rusher and a defense that has played just well enough to let the offense dictate the flow of the game. Some coaches talk about being five plays away from being in a close game... Notre Dame is two plays away from being undefeated and playing for the National Championship. And I'm feeling pretty good about my dark horse picks of Stovall, Wooden, Mays and Powers-Neal, but I’d feel even better if my 31-28 upset pick over USC held up. By the way, the same complaints about our defense you're hearing this year are the same ones we heard in 1992. And like in 1993 under Minter, we'll be moving from an inexperienced defense with four returning starters, to one of the most experienced defenses in the country with nine returning starters.
And don’t listen to those whining about Notre Dame’s supposed weaker than expected schedule. According to Jeff Sagarin, our schedule ranks 20th in the country… that's harder than every team in the top 10 except for two. And yes, it’s tougher than Oregon’s. As The Rock predicted early in the year (when everyone told us how we couldn’t win again with an impossibly hard schedule,) our schedule would be used against us at the end of the year. The next time a putrid rollerball uniform stealing Duck quacks up about their BCS miss, remind them that if they didn't get housed by USC in their house, they’d have their conference's BCS bid. Then remind them that's the only one they're entitled to and that teams who get blown out during the season usually do the same in the BCS. Anyhow, the point is moot. The rest of the bids are selected by matchups, because the conferences greedily keep their hands in the 17 million dollar till by requiring at least one team from each conference be entitled to a BCS game no matter how bad the representative. If you look at the rankings, West Virginia (and possibly Florida State and/or Colorado) is taking Oregon’s spot, not Notre Dame. Notre Dame has earned the right to a BCS game.
I’ll let ndoldtown breakdown the entire bowl argument from here:
ALL RELEVANT FACTS SHOW THAT NOTRE DAME IS ENTITLED TO A BCS BIDSome argue that it is unjust for Notre Dame to be invited to the BCS if Oregon is not because Oregon has one less loss than Notre Dame. This makes no sense because Notre Dame deserves to be in the BCS on its own merits and, in any event, Notre Dame is not the obstacle to Oregon being in the BCS. Four factors compel the conclusion that there is no credible or consistent argument for claiming that Notre Dame should not be invited to a BCS Bowl. First, if one subscribes to the school of thought that the eight best teams should get the bids, then Notre Dame is deserving based on its inclusion in the top eight of all of the objective third-party rankings relied upon by the BCS and its participating schools; Second, the reason Oregon is not going to the BCS is not because of Notre Dame, but because of agreements made by the Pac Ten and other conferences guaranteeing "conference champion" potential slots for schools other than Notre Dame which -- unlike Notre Dame -- are not top-eight teams, this year it is West Virginia; Third, the argument against Notre Dame lacks integrity and credibility because Oregon, the Pac Ten and the rest of the conferences and every one of their individual members have directly benefitted financially on multiple occasions from their own members getting bowl bids ahead of teams with better records and higher rankings; Fourth, if the conferences would simply agree that the BCS should take the top eight teams Oregon would be in, as would Notre Dame, but in any event, on an absolute basis, Notre Dame is a better team than Oregon, has accomplished more and is more deserving of a bowl bid based based on its accomplishments this year.
1. If the Standard is That The Eight Best Teams Should Go To The BCS, Notre Dame Deserves An Invitation.
If Oregon's argument is that the best teams should go to the BCS, then they have no argument with Notre Dame going, but only with Oregon being excluded. Every accounting of the top eight teams by unbiased third-party sources used by the BCS schools includes Notre Dame. The coaches poll, made up of coaches from every conference, places Notre Dame in the top eight teams in the country. Tellingly, the coaches from every conference have an incentive to vote against Notre Dame in order to help their own conferences and increase the payout to their schools. Notre Dame has no conference brethren who are incented to vote for her. Yet, in this poll in which the voters interests are almost uniformly opposed to Notre Dame, Notre Dame is listed in the top eight teams. The AP poll, filled with writers from across the country places Notre Dame in the top eight. The BCS poll, which combines the human and computer polls places Notre Dame in the top eight teams. If the just thing is for the BCS to include the top eight teams, then Notre Dame should be in and Oregon has no argument with Notre Dame. So why is it that Oregon is not in the BCS?
2. The Reason Oregon is Not Going to The BCS is Not Notre Dame, But The Guaranteed Invite of Conference Champions When They Are Not One of The Eight Best Teams In The Nation.
Oregon is one of the top eight teams in the human polls and the BCS melding of human and computer polls. The reason it is not getting one of the eight slots is not because a Notre Dame team outside the top eight is taking its spot, but because of a deal made by all the conferences -- including the Pac Ten -- to guarantee that their conference champion gets a guaranteed bid whether it is one of the top eight teams in the country or not. If the BCS took the top eight teams, Notre Dame, Oregon and Ohio State would all be in, while West Virginia - rated number eleven - would be out. But West Virginia gets an automatic bid. Thus, the real complaint for Oregon -- if it advocates invitations based only on "merit," meaning inclusion of the top eight teams in the BCS -- is with the BCS system of rewarding conference champions outside of the top eight.
3. The 2005 Notre Dame Team is More Deserving Of A BCS Bid Than At Least One Guaranteed Invitee From Every BCS Conf. Over The Last Six Years.
Given the foregoing, attempting to criticize Notre Dame -- a top eight team -- because Oregon or OSU don't get into the BCS this year is selective, inconsistent and, frankly, unprincipled. The fact is that it is the conferences' demand that their champions -- and not the eight top teams -- be guaranteed BCS bids that has led to this situation of top-eight teams being excluded. This has occurred almost every year without any of the criticism we hear now. This year, Notre Dame is 9-2 and rated in the top eight by every significant rating source. Yet every BCS conference has had a team with lesser credentials (more losses and a lower rank) get a BCS bid based on a contractual deal made by those conferences with the BCS or an individual BCS bowl. To wit: Big Ten (2000 - a three-loss non-top ten Purdue team goes to the Rose Bowl, while both one-loss and top ten Virginia Tech and two-loss and top-ten Nebraska are excluded due to Big-Ten conference champ guaranteed bid); Big East (2004 - three-loss non-top ten Pitt goes to Fiesta Bowl, while one-loss Louisville and two-loss Cal are excluded due to Big East conference champ guaranteed bid); Pac Ten (1999 - three-loss non-top ten Stanford goes to Rose Bowl, while one-loss and top ten Kansas State is excluded from the BCS by the Pac Ten's guaranteed bid); ACC (2002 - four-loss, non-top ten Florida State goes to Sugar Bowl, while two-loss and top ten Texas is excluded due to the ACC's guaranteed bid); SEC (2001 - three-loss LSU goes to Sugar Bowl, while both two-loss and top-ten Oklahoma and Texas are excluded from BCS due to SEC's guaranteed bid); Big 12 (2003 - three-loss Kansas State goes to Fiesta Bowl, while one-loss Miami (Oh) excluded from BCS due to Big Twelve guaranteed bid).
As illustrated above, the argument against Notre Dame this year by Oregon and the Pac Ten is selective, inconsistent and lacks integrity given prior positions and actions. The fact is that when non-top-eight teams with a worse record who happen to be from one of the large conferences squeeze out teams with better records and rankings based on the guaranteed conference bids, other conference members of the school getting the bid do not call it an injustice -- they fall mute. For example, I don't recall Pac Ten schools and officials calling for one-loss Kansas State to be included in the BCS out of a sense of justice in 1999. Oregon and every other Pac Ten school gets money because of deals guaranteeing the invitation of a Pac Ten school to the Rose Bowl over any better qualified teams. Now Oregon may be hurt by the exact agreement from which it has benefitted in prior years at other teams' expenses when West Virginia gets one of the eight guaranteed BCS slots. Nor did ACC officials claim it was unfair for four-loss FSU to go to the Sugar Bowl in 2002 instead of higher-ranked with a better record Texas). Given this history, it is not consistent for conference members to now object to inclusion in the BCS of a top-eight Notre Dame team with better credentials than their own members have had when they have gotten bids in the last six years. In any event, Oregon has little basis on which to claim as unjust the same type of result from which it has lined its pockets in the past as a Pac Ten member, and it especially has no argument with Notre Dame, which is in the top eight and not benefitting from any "guarantee".
4. Notre Dame is a Better Team and More Deserving Than Oregon.
While I would encourage the Pac Ten to switch its position and advocate that the best eight teams go to the BCS, thus permitting both Oregon and Notre Dame in, it is clear that Notre Dame has accomplished more than Oregon this year. Notre Dame plays a tougher schedule than Oregon according to Sagarin, which rates Notre Dame's schedule 20th and Oregon's 31st. Of course, Sagarin does a true and complete strength of schedule ranking, which includes the records of opponents' opponents. Using the Oregon preferred method of simply adding up wins and losses of opponents, it gets more credit for beating 6-5 Houston than Notre Dame gets for beating 5-6 Tennessee and more credit for beating 8-4 Montana than Notre Dame gets for beating 7-4 Michigan. Using a neutral example, surely nobody would believe that an undefeated Montana is better than a one-loss Michigan. It is just such untoward results that the Sagarin strength of schedule analysis precludes and it is why that -- as opposed to the simple totalling of opponenet wins and losses -- is the preferred way to measure strength of schedule. And that analysis favors Notre Dame as having a tougher schedule than Oregon by eleven ranks. Alternatively, if, as Oregon suggests, we should ignore strength of schedule and all other factors and only consider whether a team has one more loss than another, then in that case, TCU and Lousiville (both one-loss teams) have equal claim to the BCS with Oregon, and TCU and Lousiville should get BCS bids over Ohio State and Georgia if it wins the SEC championship game. But of course nobody is making that argument, nor would Oregon advocate it.
Other factors of significance: Even with its tougher schedule, Notre Dame has a larger average margin of victory than Oregon, has given up fewer points per game and scored more points per game, ranks ahead of Oregon nationally in ever major NCAA offensive statistical category, has both the number one QB in the nation in terms of touchdown passes and the number one wide receiver in terms of touchdown catches and finalists for the Heisman, O'Brien, Biletnikoff and Mackey awards. Clearly something is amiss if Oregon is trying to argue that Notre Dame is not an excellent team.
Probing further, against common opponent USC, Notre Dame led until the last play of the game, while Oregon lost by 32 at home. I have also looked to find an at-large team in the history of the BCS that lost by 32 in the regular season, and could not find one. Such a humiliating defeat would, one would expect, at least temper unqualified demands of "deservedness". Additionally, Oregon scheduled a Division 1AA opponent, Montana, to get its tenth win as opposed to Notre Dame's nine. Finally, while Oregon complains about Notre Dame's seven-point road victory over 5-6 Stanford, it conveniently ignores its own wins of seven points over 3-8 Arizona and three points over 4-7 Washington State. At the end of the day, I am comfortable with the position that Notre Dame is superior to Oregon, but even if one disagrees, it is hard to imagine that one could say Oregon is plainly superior to Notre Dame or that some great injustice is being done by choosing Notre Dame over Oregon.
duckman said:
posted on November 30, 2005 3:41 AM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
Cwokk,
That’s the most bias post I think I have ever read. The only thing that you can objectively say with truthfulness is if we are counting the teams ranking when Oregon and ND played them, then both teams played 4 ranked teams. If you want to be realistic about it and count the teams that are currently ranked then Oregon played 2 (beating Fresno State and losing to USC)and ND played 2(Their only claim to fame, almost beating but still losing to USC and beating Michigan). You also mention all the bowl eligible teams that ND beat but not Oregon so I will tell you. ND beat 3 teams that are currently bowl eligible if you count BYU and NAVY(a pure act of desperation and kind of a joke). The only respectable bowl eligible team that ND beat was Michigan. Oregon beat 3 quality bowl eligible teams. This fact alone mean Oregon had a tougher schedule, But lets be extremely objective and assume that ND’s and Oregon strength of schedule are equal. ND lost 2 (to a 5-6 Mich. State team and USC) games and Oregon only lost 1 (to USC) . Oregon plays in a BCS conference and ND dose not. Oregon is ranked above ND in the BCS polls. These are all facts. I don’t blame ND for going to the Fiesta Bowl. Any team would jump to play in a BCS bowl. I am mad at the BCS for Destroying the foundation for which the BCS games were made for by selecting a team that is obviously inferior to make some extra money. This is assuming that the BCS doesn’t come their senses and math up Ohio State and Oregon like they should. You should not try to justify the unjust. You should sit back be thankful that you can always get into a bowl game that you do not deserve. Stop gloating and hang your heads like the beggars you are. P.S.GO DUCKS!!!
Penn State Girl said:
posted on November 30, 2005 10:51 AM — 71.225.140.2 — link — abuse?
It IS all about money but it's still crazy. We PSUers were told for weeks Fiesta Bowl, Fiesta Bowl. Penn State had the LARGEST alumni organization in the country. Joe Paterno is already a legend. How much could the TV ratings improve w/ND? Certainly TVs will be turned OFF by halftime because the game will undoubtly stink. Personally, I think we should BOYCOTT ALL FRITO LAY PRODUCTS!! Let ND fans buy them, then they'll see exactly how much the "rest" of the college football fans can contribute! Dump the Fiesta Bowl and give the BSC to the Citrus Bowl people - that'll make it about the money! Then ND can play in their own Fiest Bowl EVERY YEAR - no matter where their ranked - and everyone will be happy!!
WVU-2 said:
posted on November 30, 2005 11:51 AM — 207.69.137.8 — link — abuse?
Heres is the problem DUCKS,Your record is 10-1 ND is 9-2.Therefore you lose!!!If they were 8-3 YOU still lose.I;m sure the good people at ND here you Quacking,not to say you have brought up a good point.But how would it look if by chance you,won against ND.let us see ducks ND lost to Micnigan S, 5-6 ND beat navy 6-4,Syracuse 1-10 Tennesee 5-6 and Stanford what a joke.Thats why you can not Play these guys for your own safety.We at WVU would never want to take on such power.Here one mountie rooting for you. GO Ducks.
Robert said:
posted on November 30, 2005 1:51 PM — 69.138.3.239 — link — abuse?
loco, You are forgetting the fact that WVU and possibly Florida State/Colorado already have their spots locked in. The only way Notre Dame can get in is to take an at large over a team like Oregon. Notre Dame will get in because they have better national coverage and will draw better on TV. There are factors involved that reflect more then team strength. Even if WVU were out you might have questions as to whether they deserved a bid more then someone like LSU.
cwokk said:
posted on November 30, 2005 2:56 PM — 192.44.136.103 — link — abuse?
Thank you LocoNdFan11
I guess the bottom line is everyone else can continue to cry, whine, bad mouth, and hate Notre Dame. The ones that love to watch us with the hope that we will lose are the ones that give us the ratings that put us in the BCS games. No one will flip on the TV just to watch Oregon lose because when it comes down to it, nobody really cares about Oregon one way or the other. Keep increasing those ratings haters!Austin said:
posted on November 30, 2005 6:06 PM — 68.1.249.214 — link — abuse?
All you ND haters miss one very important point. Once the nation watches USC & Texas play, what other games does the country want to see? Outside of regions, no one cares about the other bowl games. The one that will draw the most attention besides the National Championship will be ND and whoever they play. You ND haters will tune in to see the Irish get beat and the lovers will tune in to watch them kick butt. There's an old saying in politics that holds true for sports; follow the money!
IrishJT said:
posted on November 30, 2005 7:03 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
Hey Duck Fans...maybe you have missed it because the Sports section at Starbucks always seems to be missing, but Notre Dame does not play in a conference. You all continually reference how Oregon plays in a BCS conference and Notre Dame does not, tacitly implying ND plays in a Non-BCS conference.
When the BCS was organized, Notre Dame was included in the BCS. It was determined by the BCS that we didn't need to belong to a conference in order to get the bid. Welcome to 2005.
IrishJT said:
posted on November 30, 2005 7:19 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
...and by the way, to those of you BCS "purests", Notre Dame would love to play a Big 12, Big East or PAC 10 schedule. We would be much like Florida State was to the ACC a few years ago. However, we opt, year in and year out, to play the toughest teams from the Big 10, the ACC, the SEC and the PAC 10. This year was no exception. Four of the first 5 Irish opponents were ranked when Notre Dame played them. BYU and Navy are going to bowls...which is more than 6 PAC 10 schools can boast, 7 SEC schools, 5 Big 10 schools and nearly all of the Big East and Big 12.
Please refrain from using the term "BCS Conference" from this moment forward, especially in the context of trying to make your particular team seem more worthy of anything because of its conference affiliation. That's like parking a Pontiac next to a Porsche and bragging that you both chose the same garage...it's meaningless and only intended to undeservedly make you feel better about your station in life/college football.
Also, even if Notre Dame were ranked 12th, we'd still be going to the Fiesta Bowl and pocketing $15M...CASH!!!!! We would just be frustrating the fans of a few more schools (Miami, Auburn, TCU, maybe UCLA and Georgia). It's called a "body of work." You can start your tradition next year.
mark said:
posted on November 30, 2005 8:01 PM — 71.114.96.122 — link — abuse?
I hope ND does play Oregon.........Every expert in the college ranks has already stated that Brady Quinn will destroy the Oregon defense. Besides give "The Weiss" a month to prepare for the ducks..........And it's over. Ohio State and Penn State will be a much tougher matchup for the Irish. Those teams will battle the Irish till the end. As for Penn State girl, if the Irish don't play PSU this year, take a look at week two next season. Penn State vs ND. Guess what, you'll have your chance. Only one catch ND returns 18 starters and PSU must force all their 5th and 6th and 7th year seniors off the playing field........Good luck with that one.........You'll need it. Nothing but great things to say about Ohio State. I always root for them all the time!!!! I beleive that the top 8 teams should be given the BCS bids, however, that is not the way the conference presidents want it........Hopefully Florida State and Georgia can win this weekend and take more BCS slots away from Oregon....Maybe next year Oregon can choose to play UCLA like the Irish will, that's right ND will play both USC/UCLA in the same year. Oregon will no doubt "duck" one of those teams as it did this year.........Because of Demand ND has to make up their schedules 7 years in advance. They can't predict how those teams will be that far in advance. Lloyd Carr U of M fame, has anounced that after the ND vs Michigan series current contract ends, he does not want to renew it.........Why is that, maybe because the writing is on the wall. Pete Carroll said it best when he said, "Notre Dame is going to be trouble for everyone from now on".
Mr. Button said:
posted on December 1, 2005 12:43 AM — 68.231.33.24 — link — abuse?
41-9
All of this conversation seems really familiar. All of the "Notre Dame belongs" and "the Pac-10 is a weak conferance" Right right right. it was 2001 when ND lost 41-9 to the Oregon State Beavers. How has ND's post season record been since? not good is the correct answer.Truth is that the Pac is a great conferance and only seems weak because all of the teams beat each other up.
Sombody was talking about the margin on win between ND/Oregon and USC and came to the conclusion that because it was smaller with ND theyre the better team. Look at the margin of win over stanford. Oregon killed them/ND made it by.
If ND lost their quarterback mid season...they would be done. Oregon still wins with #2 and #3. now which is the better team
seriously.
duckman said:
posted on December 1, 2005 1:16 AM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
OK IrishJT, you debated one fact now how about the other 2, or do you not want to talk about it. Next lets talk about your so called history. ND hasn’t won a bowl game in 12 years. ND has lost the last 7 (YES 7) bowls they played in, getting their asses handed to them two out of three bye the Beavers. Lets go further back. ND since 1980 is 6-11 in bowl games. Don’t try to ride the glory of 50 years ago. If anything the current team is destroying their history bye taking things they haven’t earned. I haven’t herd these so-called experts saying that ND would pick apart Oregon’s defense (I have herd a lot of experts saying that the only reason ND is there is the money),but just remember these are the same experts that picked them to beat Stanford by 16 points (won a lot of bets on that one). All the Irish want to talk compare the USC games, but when Stanford (a team that lost to UC Davis) is mentioned all coments muttered. Should we mention 5-6 Mich. State again? I am not going to waisttime retyping things that are in previous posts but the evidence is plain as day. ND took a bowl bid away from a deserving team (if not Oregon than someone else) and you want to gloat about it. Before you all start calling me names just remember THE IRISH WILL(ONCE AGAIN) GET SPANKED and you will have to start posting under another name just to save face. ND is a JOKE!! ND present history is a JOKE!! And because you cant admit that you are in a position deserved by someone else you are a JOKE!!! Give me A good argument or don’t waist your time typing and my time responding. Maybe you Irish should ask War eagle for some help, because your posts suck. P.S.GO DUCKS!! P.P.S. Hang your heads in shame!!
posted on December 1, 2005 12:56 PM — 131.50.151.8 — link — abuse?
HAHAHAHAHA Listening to all of you bicker is funny. I am a hardcore OSU fan and will be for life. I live in Tucson and went to the Arizona Oregon game, and to tell you the truth, Oregon is a joke. The U of A would have beat the living crap out of Oregon if the recievers could have caught the ball. So please dont talk about how great your defense is when Arizona was picking you guys apart. I'll leave it at that. GO BUCKEYES........JAN 2ND FIESTA BOWL OSU-ND
NDFAN said:
posted on December 1, 2005 1:18 PM — 65.194.222.88 — link — abuse?
I would LOVE to see the Irish play PSU in the Fiesta. That would be a far better game than ND-OHIO State. Im hoping and praying that somehow this can happen - but it doesnt look good. That way when ND wins it should shut alot of people up.
tkjwonta said:
posted on December 1, 2005 2:30 PM — 129.93.190.178 — link — abuse?
Basically the reasoning behind ND's at-large BCS bid is based on historical love for the golden domers and a close game with USC. In this era of BCS controlling the world, why will the BCS bowls not reflect their own rankings? Let me return to the "almost beat USC" argument. Good teams are good because week in and week out they play well and beat their opponent. As a nebraska fan, we were dejected at a last second miraculous loss to Texas Tech who at that time was quickly climbing the polls. We realized however, that that did not define us as a good team, especially after the missouri and kansas fiascoes. This is much the same as ND's situation, now given USC is better than texas tech, but ND is better than nebraska as well. Notre Dame did play one good game against USC but they lost, and then lost again to a mediocre program. Notre Dame should drop back into the top-level non-bcs bowls where they belong.
Drake Pearson said:
posted on December 1, 2005 5:11 PM — 207.28.197.161 — link — abuse?
The Irish are the New York Yankees of college football. Even if they don't win, people will still tune and and the stadium will be packed. Oregon is the Minnesota Twins of college football. Regardless of their success over the past couple of years, virtually no one gives a f*ck about them and they never will. I hope ND plays Ohio State because it would be a hell of a game. I'd also love to see this match up because the combination of ND fans and OSU fans would equal one crazy weekend in Phoenix. No one on the coasts knows how to tailgate like fans in the Midwest. I hope the Fiesta Bowl officials pass up the Lame Ducks and make the right choice.
jpe said:
posted on December 1, 2005 6:02 PM — 24.165.206.243 — link — abuse?
First of all,it is so wonderful that we live in a country that gives us the freedoms to question wither or not ND or the Ducks play each other. Who really cares if the BCS is incorrect--there can always be changes-During the holiday season be thankful for the game of football and this wonderful nation in which we live! Go IRISH-
locoNDfan11 said:
posted on December 1, 2005 10:31 PM — 69.211.121.107 — link — abuse?
Robert- I know what you mean, and that was the first thing i said. The system is corrupt. The top 8 teams should make it to a BCS game and that would not include WV. However, because the Big East gets a spot WV has already clinched their spot, but i personally dont believe thats the way a team should get a BCS spot. What would be worse is if FSU gets in after losing 3 in a row and going to a BCS game with four loses.
Irishman said:
posted on December 1, 2005 11:28 PM — 68.58.69.197 — link — abuse?
Wow! After skimming through these posts I can't possibly stay quiet!
Lots of emotion here and I'm blessed with plenty too. I'll try to be as unbiased as a very serious and life long Irish fan can be.
1st. Lots of talk about Irish, Penn St., Ohio St, Oregon, etc. Here's my take. The Irish undoubtedly have a national following. Someone said they are like the Dallas Cowboys, I liken them to the NY Yankees. There are two kinds of Irish fans; the true fanatics like me and the Irish haters like some of you. Very few folks are nuetral or don't have a strong appreciation for them or a strong dislike (even though it is often driven by misperception and sometimes just plain jealousy). That following converts to big bucks as folks tune in hoping to see them win and others tune in hoping to see them lose. The only ones that can't lose on that deal is the promoters and the TV! The Bucks have a fanatical following too and while it tends to me more regional a matchup of ND/OSU would garner a lot of interest and make that bowl a huge financial success. Bowls exist for one reason, to make money. Hard to resist don't you think? Oregon is a great school (most noted though for their real ugly uniforms) and has a great and deserving team but they don't bring any real interest to the game much outside of the state of Oregon. That's not a put down, that's just a fact. West Virginia and Virginia Tech are pretty much in the same boat as Oregon (although neither's uniforms are near as ugly). I think Penn State would match Ohio State in draw, at least this year because the hype for the old man would be intense (their uniforms aren't ugly just real plain).
2nd. All those schools have had great years and all are deserving and would represent themselves well in a bowl. No real Irish fan would say we are happy at 9-2 but from where we were, we are smiling, not because we are 9-2 but because we of the apparent promise of the future. I have been an Irish fan for 50+ years and I know that Irish fans are never truly happy until they are #1 and even then not 100%. (I still look back with regret that the 4th quarter ND field attempt just missed and ND had to settle for the infamous tie with MSU in '66!) The fact is that Oregon, OSU, WV, Va. Tech, Penn St., etc. might all be able to beat ND in a bowl game. Heck ND has lost 7 straight bowl games so we know they could lose. Don't sell them short though this is a good team and should be competitive with anybody they play so they could just as likely beat any of those teams this year. I've been to 7 of their games and watched the other 4 on TV and I think I have a realistic perspective of where they are. I've seen a lot of ND teams play over many years and this is not the best by any stretch but they are the best since 1993 which was a VERY good team.
3rd. I agree with the comments about don't hate the team, hate the system. This BCS nonsense could be easily solved with a very simple playoff. Play all the bowl games like they are now or any way you like. When the bowls are done roll a final poll and take the highest ranked 4 teams that WON their bowl game and let them settle it on the field. Think about it, only two extra games and its settled. ALL the bowl games become important now and they all make money instead of just a couple. They are all important because realistically any team in the top 10 or 12 spots has a legitimate chance to play for the title if they can impressively beat a higher ranked team and if some of the top ranked teams lose. The bowls become a part of the playoff system and many of them are very important instead of just one or two.
4th. While you are kicking dust, kick some at the automatic conference bids. This year the Big East automatic bid is generally considered a joke. Many assume that WV is not very good but they could be, its just their conference is very weak and their road to the championship didn't have very many chuckholes. Lot's of great schools in the Big East, just not lots of powerhouse football teams. For that matter (boy will this set some folks off) the SEC doesn't really look that strong this year. (I agree its tougher than the Big East.) Alabama has a great defense and could win any one game but it was pretty apparent that when they met a team that could score some points they were in a world of hurt. I didn't think they deserved the lofty rating they were getting before they lost. I question if LSU isn't over rated too. I expect Georgia will beat them and I think the Dogs are good but not great. Auburn looks good too but not great. Tennessee helps set the tone for the conference. The Vols are a good football team having a bad year. Now look at their scores with the SEC leaders and you'll see nobody is blowing them out. I think they call that parity? The Big 12 looks like a one team conference this year with a few others that are good but not great and those teams seem to be kind of like most of the SEC teams. The Big 10 looks like a tough conference this year. OSU is deserving, Michigan is strong as usual but off in their record because they played some strong teams. Penn State certainly had a magnificent year and is very deserving. They are 1 play away from being undefeated (ND is 2 plays away from being unbeaten by the way). The PAC 10 is very strong but in a wierd sort of way. They really rack up impressive wins but they can stick in a real flopp too. Oregon is very strong but was blown away by USC. UCLA is very strong but really got waxed in the one they lost. Still there are several teams that on any given day could play with the best of them.
5th. USC and Texas do look like the cream of the crop. I was at the ND/USC game and my observations were that USC has an awesome offense. They are like Miami was around '88 only offensively much better. Their defense is not weak but compared to their offense it seems that way. USC is very good but I will also say that they were playing at the top of their game in South Bend and they were both very good and also very lucky to escape with the win. That tells me ND is capaple of playing with anyone. It was quite obvious that USC was up for that game and ND certainly didn't catch them napping or flat. Texas won at Columbus which proves they are not just running up scores against weak teams and also proves the Bucks are for real because that game was very close.
6th. All of the teams discussed in the article are pretty darn good. The Irish might get the nod because of their draw and attraction but what a mess this will be if the favored teams lose this weekend! I don't want it to happen because the Irish could get squeezed out under the right conditions! Imagine if a 4 loss Florida State team wins and is guaranted a BCS spot! Now imagine if Colorado wins and is guaranteed a BCS spot! Keep thinking and West Virginia loses and is still guaranteed a spot! Wow, does UCLA get a spot if they beat USC? Can you imagine the chaos? WV, Fla. St., Colorado, Penn St. and maybe Georgia all are guaranteed spots. If USC is still guaranteed a spot then you have a 1 loss Oregon, UCLA and Texas along with 2 loss ND, OSU, Va. Tech, and a pretty good Miami team (that waxed Va. Tech) all trying to get the final 2 spots. Folks we need a better system! It has been pure luck that this one hasn't totally melted down.
Next, for you folks that say the BCS caters to the Irish, that's not exactly true. I agree their draw speaks loudly and the bowl people would like to go for the bucks but the polls don't do them any favors. Irish fans will remember playing the toughest schedule in the country in '89 which included 9 bowl teams and losing to a Miami team in the final game down there. This was a Miami team that lost early (to Fla. St. I think) and then played about 8 practice games and had a bye the week before the Irish. So after 9 weeks of practice for the big game they beat an Irish team that was pretty bloodied and tired from playing a lot of very good teams that includes teams like USC plus Michigan and Penn State (on the road). ND then wins its bowl game convincingly against the only other unbeaten and #1 rated Colorado team. Final poll is Miami 1 and ND 2 with the logic stated that although ND proved they were the better team over time and certainly played a stronger schedule, since both had 1 loss, Miami should get it as they won the head to head game. Fast forward to '93 and ND knocks off the "unbeatable team of the century" Fla. St. team and then loses by a last second field goal to BC the following week. ND wins their bowl game and the final poll is Fla. St. #1, ND #2 with the stated logic that yeah ND won the head to head game but both loss just 1 and Fla. St. was real good and by the way Bobby is a good ol' boy and he's done everything he can do but win a title. This wasn't "Win one for the Gipper" it was "Give one to Bobby". Miami and Fla. St. had great teams. The point is Irish fans are used to being on the short end of the stick because there are so many Irish haters out there.
Finally, for all you Irish haters. Loosen up and ask yourself why you hate them? I personally think a lot of it is jealousy. Maybe its that they just don't like Rudy? If you would take the time to open your eyes and look objectively you would see a lot of good about ND. They don't always win because they strive so hard to be a shining bright spot for college athletics. Their athletes are students. The football graduation rate is 98.74% over the past 43 years. Not many schools can say that. The only ones that might be close have names like Rice, Vanderbilt, Duke and Stanford. They certainly aren't challenged by names like Miami, Michigan, Oklahoma, Georgia, etc. in this department. I also haven't seen them implement rules like that stupid celebration penalty for Irish antics. That was brought to us by those wonderful bad boy hoodlum teams called the Canes. They're so far out they're probably proud of that instead of being embarrassed like most of the rest of us would be. In short the Irish have very high academic requirements for their football players and they hold them to high standards. For comparison purposes I seem to remember a far south team with a star running back (for a team that I think weras red and white uniforms) being asked by a reporter "Herschell do you own all the records in "your school's" record book?". The young man's reply was something real close to "I don't know man, I don't read many books"! Or do you remember some years back when a big bruin of a guy was convicted out in California on a felony charge and as a part of his sentence this 4 year player (for a team that wears powder blue and gold)was ordered by the judge to learn how to read and write? As another example, ND suspended a star running back for the season this year because he was stopped off campus in his home town for a DUI. For comparison I seem to remember an enshrined southern coach years ago (that team wears crimson and white uniforms) being asked if his star running back would start on Saturday after he was arrested on a serious felony charge and the reply was something like "well he hasn't broken any team rules...". I don't think you'll find a ND coach holding class at the local strip bar or the "office" as a Cane coach used to call it. I also recall another school (that also wears red and white uniforms but this school likes to horse around with an old wagon on their field) where they had their star quarterback arrested in an undercover sting for selling drugs to an FBI agent! That same school had a shoot out in their athletic dorm whem a couple of football players decided they didn't really like each other. Bottom line is the Irish really make the effort to do things right and yet they can still win. Study the University, what it stands for and what it has achieved and love them or hate them you will respect them. I challenge you to make the effort!
By the way, am I happy to see the video review! Irish fans will recall games like a Purdue game that we won 31-30 and afterwards the Big 10 officials issued a written apology for erroneous calls that gave Purdue 14 points on 2 touchdowns that were instead an interception and a fumble recovery in the endzone that should have been ND's ball on the 20 and another 4 point swing on an erroneous call on 4th and goal from the 1 that took away a scored touchdown and put them back on tne 16 and caused them to settle for 3. We were fortunate that day though as we overcame the 18 point swing and won at the final second. Not so fortunate was the '64 team that lost a National Title when a PAC 10 (USC) official called holding on a 4th down quarterback sneak from the 1/2 yard line late in the game that took away a touchdown and resulted in a missed field goal and an oportunity for USC to come from behing with a minute left to spoil a top ranked unbeaten Irish team's season in their last game. Since we are in LA, remember the '82 game we led 13-10 and USC fumbled the ball on the 5 yard line with 48 seconds left, ND recovered it on the 2 as the back continued into the endzone without the ball? The PAC 10 (USC) official put his hands up for a touchdown and USC stole a 17-13 "win". Remember the '78 game when we were behind 24-6 in the 4th quarter and a guy by the name of Montana got busy and put us ahead 25-24 with less than a minute left? Recall the ensuing SC drive when the QB was sacked and as he was bending over and going down he tried to tuck the ball in his other arm but he got nailed and it shot out backward behind him and ND recovered? Remember the PAC 10 (USC) official that called it an incomplete forward pass and gave it back to his team so they could steal another one with a field goal with 2 seconds left? Do you remember this year when Michigan fumbled the snap on the ND 1 yard line and kicked it into the endzone and a ND safety picked it up, tried to show it to a Big 10 (Michigan) official and then walked out to the 5 yard line waving the ball saying look what I have!? Remember that meanwhile the officials are busy signaling that Michigan still owns the ball at the one even though they seem to be having a real problem finding it? Remember when Brady gets sacked a few plays later and the Michigan official (I got tired of typing Big 10) signals its Michigan's ball after first his knees hit and then when he rolls over after hitting the ground and then the ball pops free and Michigan "recovers it"? God, I love the replay! Both of those got reversed and if they hadn't Michigan might have "won" another of the many games that ND has lost through the years on bad official calls. So ND fans and fans everywhere should rejoice that maybe finally the kids can settle the issue on the field and games will no longer be won or lost strictly on the errant call of a zebra rather accidental or accidentally on purpose! The Irish might lose a favorable call sometime but I think right is right and the calls should be set true when they blow them!
Go Irish!
duckman said:
posted on December 2, 2005 7:01 AM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
IrishJT- thank you for the history lesson. I did some research and every thing you said about ND not being in a BCS conference is true and I will not use that as evidence in the future. Now tell me about the other facts mention in previous post’s. You take the weakest point and that is all you mention. I want to be enlightened by someone FACTS and NUMBERS!!
Mark- I have herd A lot of sports casters say that Oregon is getting passed on a bowl game because ND will generate more revenue. I have not herd these experts say anything about ND picking apart Oregon’s defense, but if you did hear something like that it was probably from the same experts that said ND would pick apart Stanford’s defense. Another part of your posts said that Oregon would duck USC or UCLA. You should have done some research about that one. Oregon plays both next year.
ND hasn’t won a bowl game in 12 years!! ND has only won 6 bowl games in the last 25 years. I just see a history of being over ranked and getting embarrassed when they take a bowl bid. It would not bother me if it were someone that deserved to bump Oregon off, but it is not. It is a team that bags on Oregon for playing lesser teams at the beginning of the season and the turns around and brags about beating bowl eligible teams like Navy and BYU. I have yet to figure out if this a joke or you are really serious. I wont spend time retyping previous facts, but the evidence is clear as day. P.S.GO DUCKS!!
osundhater said:
posted on December 2, 2005 10:15 AM — 150.190.9.132 — link — abuse?
I have to laugh....a ND fan that loves Ohio State? You obviously have never had the pleasure of sitting next to an OSU fan during a game? You will change your mind. These people think of nothing but themselves; they hate you and everyone else. Put OSU on your schedule each year and see how long you having "nothing but great things to say about them." It's funny how all of these ND fans are gloating now that your program appears to have "turned around". You would think having your 8 year seniors on NBC each week for many years would have made recruiting very easy. Bottom line is, the kids look at how the school has treated it's many, many head coaches and don't want to go to a school with "all of this history". Yea, dumping coaches each year is the way to teach kids about commitment and honor. This program hides behind it's golden dome crap! You are scared to join a conference, play a regular schedule, share the wealth with others, and lose your chance to beat up Navy, Stanford, and BYU each year. ND football is selfish, fake, and overrated. Take some of that $15M and put Charlie on Weight Watchers
NDDon said:
posted on December 2, 2005 12:39 PM — 129.74.13.199 — link — abuse?
All the whining will be over January 2nd, when ND thumps OSU. It's a far cry from being able to play Texas in the Rose Bowl (Due to the clutch play of a certain 2-time defending national champ), but we'll take it.
And to Tommie Trojan - "I have the utmost respect for Notre Dame! We love to play them every year! They are scary to us - every year. Nobody has kicked the crap out of USC more times than ND has." - Same ND team vs USC minus Bush and Leinart :D It's gonna be sweet.
Dale said:
posted on December 2, 2005 7:51 PM — 209.77.204.49 — link — abuse?
How much does having Notre Dame in a Bowl really increase that bowls revenues? Everyone throws out this BS about Notre Dame being a huge draw and how they will rake in the television viewers, but do they really know the numbers. Couldn't these numbers also be offset by the people who are so sick of Notre Dame that they just don't care what they do? I like watching quality football, so it looks like I will probably be missing whatever bowl game Notre Dame plays in. Get with it folks, it is not 1950 anymore, today, the name Notre Dame = mediocrity. Just boycott any game these a-holes play in.
VTBobb said:
posted on December 2, 2005 9:39 PM — 70.17.23.82 — link — abuse?
loco...I wonder if you had that same philosophy back in 2000 when a 9-2 ND ranked #10 got their only other BCS bid over a 10-1 Virginia Tech ranked #6? The results of the Fiesta Bowl showed how deserving ND was that year.
All of you ND fans stop trying to justify your bid because of your team strength. The justification is the national appeal, love them or hate them, of ND. As has been posted before, the BCS is only about trying to match the agreed upon #1 & #2 team in the country, and providing lucrative match ups for the other BCS games.
Benny Beaver said:
posted on December 2, 2005 9:56 PM — 12.65.120.19 — link — abuse?
You gotta love the Irish logic - I'm an Oregon State guy and remember 2001 - 41-9, if I remember right, plus ND loses to the Beavs last year in the Insight Bowl - what a program and the Pac-10 is weak. I'm sick of hearing from the self-indulgent who couldnt see past the end of their nose who reside in the midwest and east. You want competition, go into Fresno and take on those boys there and see how you do. Take on Boise and anyone else out here. I see on ESPN tonite that ND has been in four BCS games and lost three - wow, I'm impressed. And forget Florida State, Miami - both are weak this year.
If tradition, money, and self-delusion are the primary reason for going to a bowl, then ND and OSU are the best choices for the Fiesta. If the best teams this year are the criteria, then Oregon vs an LSU, Georgia or VT should be the choice.
Brad said:
posted on December 2, 2005 11:16 PM — 65.2.74.162 — link — abuse?
November 2
1935: In one of the most anticipated games in the history of intercollegiate football, Notre Dame shocks 81,018 onlookers at Ohio Stadium by overcoming a 13-0 fourth quarter deficit - and a 13-6 deficit with only three minutes remaining - to conquer the undefeated Buckeyes of Ohio State, 18-13. Such a comeback is unheard-of in this era, a major reason why the game would be remembered, more than any other, as "The Game of the Century." The winning score comes with thirty-two seconds left, on a 19-yard touchdown pass from Bill Shakespeare to Wayne Millner. Many feel that the term "Hail Mary Pass" originated with this play.
September 30, 1995
Buckeyes romp on the Irish!
There was as much excitement for this game as any regular non-conference game the Buckeyes had played in years. It was the first time Notre Dame and Ohio State faced off since that legendary 1935 game. And for the Buckeyes, it was a glorious day indeed. The Irish looked good in the first half as they led 17-14 at halftime, but they fell apart in the second half, and the Buckeyes and Eddie George, Bobby Hoying and Terry Glenn took over to make it a 45-26 blowout. George had 35 carries for 207 yards and officially made himself a serious Heisman contender. "I don't know how much anybody paid for tickets," said Coach Cooper, "But I guarantee you they got their money's worth."Sept: 28, 1996:
Ohio State 29, Notre Dame 16
Two top 5 teams met and Ohio State's Pepe Pearson nearly ran the opening kick off back for a touchdown. OSU thoroughly dominated the game and the score was closer than the game was.
Jan 2, 2006:
duckman said:
posted on December 3, 2005 6:47 AM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
IrishJT- thank you for the history lesson. I did some research and every thing you said about ND not being in a BCS conference is true and I will not use that as evidence in the future. Now tell me about the other facts mention in previous post’s. You take the weakest point and that is all you mention. I want to be enlightened by someone FACTS and NUMBERS!!
Mark- I have herd A lot of sports casters say that Oregon is getting passed on a bowl game because ND will generate more revenue. I have not herd these experts say anything about ND picking apart Oregon’s defense, but if you did hear something like that it was probably from the same experts that said ND would pick apart Stanford’s defense. Another part of your posts said that Oregon would duck USC or UCLA. You should have done some research about that one. Oregon plays both next year.
ND hasn’t won a bowl game in 12 years!! ND has only won 6 bowl games in the last 25 years. I just see a history of being over ranked and getting embarrassed when they take a bowl bid. It would not bother me if it were someone that deserved to bump Oregon off, but it is not. It is a team that bags on Oregon for playing lesser teams at the beginning of the season and the turns around and brags about beating bowl eligible teams like Navy and BYU. I have yet to figure out if this a joke or you are really serious. I wont spend time retyping previous facts, but the evidence is clear as day. P.S.GO DUCKS!!ammopapa said:
posted on December 4, 2005 1:32 AM — 71.33.70.206 — link — abuse?
OK...I grew up in South Bend. My sister works at the University. I've lived my whole life as a fan of the Irish!... and now live in Tucson so the chance to see them in my backyard again (2004 Insight Bowl) is a dream come true. Any comments I make about this subject are already tainted by my love for Notre Dame.... but here I go. Yes it's true, the usually tough ND schedule turned out to be a bit weaker than it started at the beginning of the year. Let's take into consideration what the teams were ranked when Notre Dame played them.
23 Pitt
3 Michigan
NR Michigan St (moved to 17 after defeating ND)
NR Washington
22 Purdue
1 USC
NR BYU
NR Tenn (Started season 3rd, Top 25 week before)
NR Navy
NR Syracuse
NR StanfordLee Corso from ESPN College Game Day did not bick the Irish to win a game until the BYU game. They were expected to finish 6-5 at best. Notre Dame has no control over how their "usually" tough schedule fares throughout the season. Unlike a team that plays in a conference and has to play 5-6 regional teams with losing records, the Irish play a schedule usually filled with the top 2 or 3 teams from a variety of conferences coast to coast... this is another reason Irish fans are in every corner of the country. Notre Dame usually plans their schedule many years in advance. I'm eagerly anticipating the Notre Dame - Arizona State matchup in Tempe in 2014. Notre Dame has even scheduled the likes of Rutgers for a series of home and aways starting in 2010. This would usually look like a "cupcake" on the schedule but Rutgers is bowl eligible this year and by the time the Irish meet Rutgers, the Scarlet Knights may be a nationally ranked team. I remember Notre Dame playing a cupcake back in the 70s named Miami of Florida.
IrishJT said:
posted on December 4, 2005 9:39 AM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
Duckman...come on!! At least try. Notre Dame has won only 6 bowl games in the last 25 years? Has Oregon even been to that many? I know, you like stats. Lets talk stats.
Notre Dame National Championships: 11 (27 if you count them all...'Bama uses 'em in calculating their 12).
Oregon Nat'l Championships: Zero. They've been beaten soundly by the eventual champ several times, but never even played for the trophy.
Notre Dame Heismann's: 7
Oregon: 0
ND/Div II schools played this year: 0
Oregon/Div II schools played this year: 1ND/Jerseys: Not ugly
Oregon/Jerseys: Really uglySo far it really looks like the University of Nike is quite the program with quite the tradition. I can't believe NBC doesn't rip up its contract with the Irish and take its road show to the Pacific Northwest. I can see it now. The first game of the year, all of college football watching as the Fighting DUCKS clash with that ole rival...Montana!!
You guys can start your tradition next year. Oregon is a joke and so is the PAC 10.
IrishJT said:
posted on December 4, 2005 4:58 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
Benny Beaver & all folks from Oregon public schools (Duckman, pay attention): First, I'm going to have to ask that grammar be something you concentrate on from here on out. You are all too often writing in a sentence structure with which I am unfamiliar. Moving along, it really doesn't matter how many BCS games Notre Dame has played, lost, won...whatever. Neither Oregon team will make it to the BCS any time soon...and this is in the PAC 10. Thank the Lord that your conference can rest on the shoulders of USC (a team that even Mark May now admits the Irish defeated) or else the PAC 10 would rival the Big East and MAC for weakest conference of 2005. I think Akron would give Oreg/Oreg St a good game. Rutgers would give Oregon all it can handle. I'm certain West Virginia would beat them soundly. I know for sure that if you took an all-star team of the nine PAC 10 teams (excepting USC) that Notre Dame, Texas, Ohio State, Penn State and Auburn would be at least a two-touchdown favorite...AND COVER THE SPREAD!!!
Go recycle your sandals! Football just ain't your bag! Go Irish!!!!!!!
duckman said:
posted on December 4, 2005 5:59 PM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
IrishJT- Do you think about these posts before you post them. You really want to ride the glory of 40 years ago. Oregon has made bowl games 10 out of the past 12 years. And that is without the OBVIOUS favoritism of the BCS. That’s more then you can say about ND. You don’t even argue any valid points in previous posts. The ND program has become a joke in the past 25 years. Oops, make that 26!! Your stats are old and argument is weak and every one knows it. Ignorance is bliss isn’t it. P.S. GO DUCKS!!
Ron Mexico said:
posted on December 4, 2005 6:33 PM — 206.211.223.52 — link — abuse?
For the Duck fans who are not happy about getting a BCS bid I think Ohio State is going to do you a favor. With that pathetic defense of Notre Dames I think OSU is going to roll up on the Irish big time. Sorry Irish fans but you havn't played a defense even close to as good as Ohio States, and I'm an SEC fan. OSU had four 1st team All Big10 and three 2nd team All Big10 players on defense alone. Throw in a QB that is probably the 2nd most improved in the country (to Quinn) who only threw 4 INTs all season. Along with 1st round WR Santonio Holmes and a running game that rolled through the Big11 the 2nd half of the season. I honestly think if Smith hadn't been suspended (and he was so it's a mute point) OSU would beat both Texas and Penn State if they played again. ND may score some points but the Irish will be one dimensional by the end of the 1st quarter. Michigan gained like 32 yds against OSU, and that was @ Michigan. Quinn won't need his 'green' jersey in this game......AJ Hawk and company will make sure his jersey is covered with green grass by the end of this game. Irish Haters should enjoy this one because OSUs o-line will tenderize that 97th rated run defense. And OSU will be favored by
4-7 pts and I say load up on the Buckeyes. Barring a suspension of their QB Smith I don't see OSUs punter ever stepping on the field. If Stanford can roll up 400+ yds of offense on you ND, do you honestly think you are going to contain a hot OSU offense?? Weis deserves every vote he gets for coach of the year and he would get mine. However as Lee Corso of GameDay puts it: If my Xs are better than your Os it doesn't matter who the coach is. OSU by at least 10.....The Mayor said:
posted on December 4, 2005 8:36 PM — 24.23.202.200 — link — abuse?
All sides in this debate make compelling arguments. It's disappointing to see all of the hatred and lack of respect for both programs and for each other (especially during the Holidays).
The Irish have a storied tradition and after years of frustration Oregon has become one a very successful program with a bowl appearance every year, save for one, since 1995 (if we count the Seattle Bowl, which we lost to a Golf School...Wake Forest). Notre Dame does travel anywhere to play anyone which you have to admire. Even Fresno State has realized that and has caught national attention for their program by travelling to some tough locations to play. I would like to see Oregon get away from the Portlands, Idahos and Montanas altogether (in my day, those were are only wins outside of Oregon State). We do have Oklahoma in Eugene next year and get to go the Big House in 2007!
Oregon fans have disliked the Irish ever since they went for the "tie" in Eugene in 1983(?) rather than go for the win...but let's show a little class and dispense with all the rantings.
The Notre Dame / Ohio State game will make for better TV ratings and that's what it's all about unfortunately. Although I certainly was looking forward to playing in the Fiesta Bowl, I am fine with playing Oklahoma in San Diego, it should be a great game.
As for our uniforms, they are awesome. Just because they're dfferent doesn't make them awful. Those of you who trash our threads, go look at your closets, I bet you could use a make-over. Besides I like the retro roller derby look.
So far, the only voice of reason in this blog has been Tommie Trojan and I can't tell you how much it pains me to admit that.
Go Ducks, Go Pac 10.
CWokk said:
posted on December 4, 2005 8:43 PM — 65.29.222.91 — link — abuse?
Shoot. ND is playing Ohio State in the Fiesta Bowl and Oregon is playing in the Holiday Bowl. This just isn't fair. But, since VA Tech and LSU helped us out, we finished 6th and were guaranteed and OSU finished 4th and were guaranteed. So, I guess Oregon should be upset with the voters who made them 5th behind OSU, b/c if they were 4th, they would have been locked in. Don't hate the Irish.
manpod said:
posted on December 4, 2005 10:02 PM — 24.147.44.172 — link — abuse?
Yeah, ND had a weak schedule playing several well known teams that had bad years. If they didn't take BC off their schedule after losing the last 4 years, they would be playing in the Justanother Bowl.
If their highlight was barely losing to USC, they barely beat Stanford with everything on the line. Hardly an inspiring performance. With that being said, every team in the country must know going into the season that ND will get the benefit of the doubt. That's just how it is.
Ohio State will give us the answer as to whether ND is a contender, or a team with good ratings and an Alumni that travels.
IrishJT said:
posted on December 4, 2005 11:07 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
Duckman,
Nice post. I thought about it and the only trouble with it is that it's riddled with errors...and sadly your grammar hasn't improved (there are fabulous exercises online that you could try).First of all, you suggest that Notre Dame fans rest on the tradition started 25 (oops 26) years ago. History, however, suggests that it goes back to the 1920's. However, and for those of you keeping score, in the past 25 years we have one a national championship, a Heismann Trophy and been ranked #1 at some point in the season no less than a half dozen times (the last time being the eighth week of Ty Willingham's first season as head coach (NY Times)). These are great accomplishments for any program, none of which the Ducks or Beavers can boast. Also, the payout of Oregon's bowl games over the last 12 years combined will not equal the payout of Notre Dame's appearance in the Fiesta this year. Insight and Holiday Bowl appearances is a wonderful accomplishment. The winner of either should have to play DeLaSalle...a high school team in California...and win to keep the money. I also notice, Duckman, that you deliberately failed to address the Heismann/National Championship numbers I put forward in one of my previous posts. It must be frustrating to argue that your program is better than any other with such little ammuntion. Hats off for trying though. Boise State said the same thing last year...then they played Georgia.
Now admittedly the Irish have slipped in the past few years. But the "joke" you speak of will be next season's pre-season top 5, so I think it is time you Oregon public school fans at least admit that the Notre Dame program has rebounded. I also think that it is time you admit that the PAC 10 is a secondary conference with many struggling programs that are perennially out of competition for a BCS game or a national championship (or even a winning season). I submit Oregon, Cal and UCLA as Exhibits 1,2 & 3.
Go Sooners!!!! And by the way, while you're in San Diego Holiday Bowling, go to the Dublin Square downtown. Tell 'em you're a Ducks fan. They'll sing you the Notre Dame fight song.
locondfan11 said:
posted on December 4, 2005 11:20 PM — 69.211.123.177 — link — abuse?
IRISH JT
Thanks for all your support of the Irish. As a true Notre Dame fan I know were you are coming from. We'll just have to silence all the critics on January 2nd. Look for me, I'll be the 17 year old in all green body paint!!!
- By the way duckman:
This is what you said a couple of days back -I have not herd (good spelling by the way) these experts say anything about ND picking apart Oregon’s defense, but if you did hear something like that it was probably from the same experts that said ND would pick apart Stanford’s defense.Well lets take a look at what Notre Dame did agains Stanford's defense:
First Downs- 30
Rushing Yards- 231
Passing Yards- 432
TOTAL- 663
INDIVIDUAL
SAMARDZIJA- 191 Yards- Surpasses 1,000 yards on the year
STOVALL- 136 Yards- Surpasses 1,000 yards on the year
WALKER- 186 Rushing Yards- Surpasses 1,000 yards on the year
QUINN- 432 yards- 65% completion (85% in second half)If thats not shredding apart a defense then i dont know what it takes. When was the last time Oregon had a bad offensive day and had 632 yards. Actually when was the last time Oregon had more than 632 yards in a game. It didnt happen this year, I know that for sure.
Fan of the Game said:
posted on December 5, 2005 11:02 AM — 12.43.234.14 — link — abuse?
I doubt that anyone here is a fan of the BCS. If someone is please leave. If you don't agree with the BCS system, then why bitch about whether or not your team got in. I understand that there is considerably more money at stake, but lets not make this about the money, the BCS has already done that to the point of ruining college football. Oregon is ranked higher in the BCS standings than Notre Dame, but the BCS selection committee chose Notre Dame to play in its BCS bowl. The BCS isn't concerned with rankings, they want tv ratings. Notre Dame does have a larger fan base and would probably draw a bigger audience. The BCS is just trying to make a good business decision. Regardless of who we think is the better team, the BCS has already stated that they think Oregon is better. Notre Dame just brings more to the table. That's business.....not football. I like the Irish and respect their storied traditions, but they are not in a BCS game because they have a better team, just more fans. I for one, am against what the BCS has done and is doing to college football. I haven't watched a BCS game in 3 years and don't plan on watching this year. Most of us agree that the BCS is bullsh*t, but we constantly argue the point of whether or not a team deserves a BULLSH*T GAME. Seems as though most of us who hate the BCS are still buying into it, and as long as we do, the BCS will be here.
The Mayor said:
posted on December 5, 2005 3:14 PM — 24.23.202.200 — link — abuse?
IrishJT and duckman...there is a good chance that one of you is going to look rather foolish by January 3rd. I hope you keep up the discourse after it's all over. If you really want to argue about something worthwhile, try addressing which is a "better" sports film,
Notre Dame's "Rudy" or UO's "Without Limits?" That way you can continue your ranting through all eternity.
the sh*t hits the fan said:
posted on December 5, 2005 10:52 PM — 72.23.99.74 — link — abuse?
I would like to pose a question for all u nd nonbeleivers (like osuhater in post 70 who said "You would think having your 8 year seniors on NBC each week for many years would have made recruiting very easy") who think that nd is supposedly sporting 6 year plus players on their roster, and that question is wtf? Anyone who knows anything about notre dame knows that they sport a 4 years and ur out theory in 95% of non-architecual based majors(this is because anyone majoring in architecture can, and usually will opt. for an aditional year of studying in italy), rarely will they keep a classman for 5 years and u will basically NEVER finda 6+ year classmember on campus let alone on the football field any notre dame student or alumni will agree... btw good luck Dan (c post 87), we hope u'll soon be able to lead the team as good as Brady........... o and lets take another look at nd, who has 18 returning starting players next year?, certainly not the ducks, this would mean that there are 18 players out there at nd stadium that only have 3/4ths or in many cases 3/5's or 3/6's the experience of other teams, basically our young team can beat most of ur teams that are sporting a roster of 80% (give or take) Seniors.
Matt said:
posted on December 5, 2005 11:19 PM — 72.49.126.153 — link — abuse?
We all now know the ND is playing OSU. All of those Oregon fans, boohoo sorry about your luck. I believe the reasons for this setup outweighs the reasons for the ND-Oregon setup.
First the fans. Notre Dame will pull out their "green jerseys" (And that did them alot of good in the USC game). And it was previously stated that sittign next to an OSU fan is a pain, which (being an avid OSU fan) is true. We are loud and mean to anyone that wishes to oppose us, just be glad you are not a michigan fan. OSU fans will cheer the loudest, and boo the loudest. OSU fans will travel any where for an epic game (such as this one). This attitude adds to the intensity of the gameplay. And yes there are OSU fans everywhere, Ohio Sate University is one of the largest colleges and it has alumni everywhere who are loyal to the death.
Second, both teams are good. ND haters, whine all you want, but the Irish has a good team. Brady Quinn (might I add he is from Ohio) is an excellent quarterback, and he has the runningbacks and receivers to throw to, who will do their job. They have an excellent offense, and im sure OSU will not only look forward to playing them, but fear them as well. The ND coach is amazing, he single-handedly trasformed the lame excuse for a football team back into a highly respectable and challenging program. OSU's team has many good players as well. We will start with the offense, watching in all but the last game was pretty much a terrible display. Turnovers all of the time, and mistakes galore. Even with the great receivers, Holmes and Gonzalez, we cannot manage to create a good passing game. OSU has the habit of runnign into an area where the defense gathers. However, the OSU - Michigan game the offense stepped up, and Troy Smith became a threat. The Defense is flat out amazing. ND will have a difficult time taking the punishment that OSU will give. A.J. Hawk will show speed on defense ND is not used to. If Carpenter is back, Quinn better have quick feet or an open receiver. An amazing defense against and amazing offense will prove to be epic.
Third both teams have the love/hate thing going for them. There are diehard fans for ND and OSU. The OSU game wil be watched by other BIG TEN teams fans, and of course some will watch to see one team lose.
Its obvious that this was the best choice. OSU is a large school with an immense fan base and respected by msot of the Big Ten. ND is respecte by many all over, and the fact that people hate them only makes their ratings increase. To be honest Oregon is not even heard of in the East. Probable because of the lack of National Championships and Hiesmans. Even if the West doesnt think much of OSU, they at least are mentioned, you cannot overlook their recent National Championship. Hence, OSU and ND could not have been a better choice.duckman said:
posted on December 6, 2005 6:31 AM — 66.223.208.241 — link — abuse?
Fan of the game- that is one of the best posts I have ever read. You have enlightened me.
IrishJT- You have gave us many foudationless accusations. You have also resorted to trying to mock my style of writing. This is an act of desperation to draw attention away from the message. I read a post somewhere the said “if you cant discredit the message try to discredit the messenger”. My writing might not be perfect but my message is loud and clear. I know that even when ND gets blown out you will never agree with me. This is the last post that I will dedicate to your enlightenment. I wish the Irish the best of luck and hope that one day they might truly EARN a bowl game or hopefully one day a playoff spot. P.S.GO DUCKS!!!
mr. waitandsee said:
posted on December 6, 2005 10:08 AM — 71.113.188.202 — link — abuse?
IF YOU WANT TO BE OBJECTIVE AND LOOK AT THE NUMBERS NOTRE DAME CONSISTANTLY HAS THE TOUGHEST SCHEDULE IN COLLEGE FOOTBALL.
You want numbers lets look at numbers. Look at this site for objective findings about strength of schedule:
Sagarin goes through the numbers in an objective way.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin-archive.htm
Here is what ND's schedule has been over the last 7 years:
2005: the 19th toughest schedule in college football (calculated to date)
2004: the 5th toughest schedule in college football
2003: the #1 toughest schedule in college football
2002: 14th toughest schedule in college football.
2001: 14th toughest schedule in college football.
2000: 36th toughest schedule in college football.
1999: 10th toughest schedule in college football.This is compared to over about 240 teams! NDs schedule has been in the top 6 % of the toughest schedules all but one year in the past 6. (when it was in the top 15%) If there is ANY team THAT COMES CLOSE please let me know.
Anyone who doesn't believe ND would be much better off in a conference is kidding themselves. Any conference would make thier season *much* easier than it is. Look at the average strength of schedule for any conference team - big ten - Sec you name it. ND will have a tougher schedule.
Notre Dame is in a unique position that they play some teams from almost every major conference. They tend to pick the teams with above average or even excellent traditions in each conference. Yes Tennessee was weak this year as was Purdue and Pitt but its tough to tell that before the season starts. If Notre Dame played in a conference thier schedule would be much easier. Can anyone look at the numbers and dispute this?Some conferences should not be considered Division I A. They simply aren't in the same league. And playing a division 1 AA team is ridiculous.
Gerald said:
posted on December 6, 2005 12:00 PM — 216.113.128.239 — link — abuse?
Oregon and PAC - 10 fans:
Stop being hypocrites! Live by your own standard! For the past two seasons, you have been denigrating SEC teams Auburn and LSU in their comparison to mighty USC because they played a I - AA team. The fact that Auburn and LSU still wound up playing more ranked teams AND more top ranked teams did not matter. The fact that Auburn and LSU were not asking to be ranked ABOVE Southern Cal but to merely SHARE the title as teams in similar situations have in the past did not matter (i.e. the PAC - 10's own Washington with Miami in 1991).
So now, the worm has turned. Oregon has more wins and fewer losses, BUT THEY PLAYED A I - AA TEAM! So none of that counts. The great season that Oregon had, the fact that they only lost to the defending two time national champs, Kellen Clemens outstanding season, their best defense in years, the great coaching job that Belloti and the guy from BYU did when Clemens got injured ... NONE OF THAT STUFF COUNTS BECAUSE YOU GUYS PLAYED A I - AA TEAM! Right?
Oh, and for all of you people who claim that Auburn should not have shared the 2004 title because USC beat them in 2002 and 2003 ... well the same deal applies. Oregon went 5 - 6 last year. Ohio State and Notre Dame were both bowl teams. Now the fact that Oregon hired a new offensive coordinator and some of their players matured, making them a totally different team from last year ... that means NOTHING, right? Just like it meant NOTHING for Auburn! Just as the 13 - 0 Auburn team was no different or better than the 5 loss teams that USC played (and to this day insist was "the SEC's best" when in fact they did not even finish 2nd in their own division either year) in 2002 and 2003, this 10 - 1 Oregon team OBVIOUSLY is no different from the 5 - 6 stinker last year, or the ones that finished 15 - 12 and losers of bowl games to MINNESOTA and WAKE FOREST the two previous years (at least Auburn was 17 - 9 and won their bowl games in 02 and 03).
Quit having double standards and complaining! Your team finished #2 in the PAC - 10 (without having to play UCLA or for that matter any other ranked team) and had one of the better turnarounds in college football (yes, better than Notre Dame, who despite what their fans claim was a bowl team AND beat Big 10 champs Michigan last season, in addition to losing to both BC and Pitt on the final plays of the game ... no ND fan will admit that Syracuse, Pitt, and Purdue were way down this season AND they ducked BC).
If anyone has a right to complain, it is us SEC fans. The SEC had 4 teams that finished with 9 wins or more, including two 10 win teams. And you know what? Unlike Oregon (who again did not play a single ranked team ... I am glad that PAC - 10 people were finally forced to stop claiming that Fresno was some top 10 program), LSU played 9 - 2 Auburn, 9 - 2 Alabama, and 10 - 2 UGA. They also opened their season on the road against bowl bound Arizona State with a new QB and coach after a hurricane wiped them out (LSU is 3 - 0 against the PAC - 10 the last 3 seasons, all on the road) an beat Florida (who beat ACC champ FSU)! And what does LSU, a team who beat 2 of the BCS top 15 and 4 bowl bound teams get? To play the Peach Bowl while Ohio State and Notre Dame, TWO TEAMS WHO BEAT NO ONE IN THE TOP 20, play in the Fiesta Bowl!
What does Auburn, who beat SEC champs UGA, 9 - 2 Alabama, and Florida (again the team who beat ACC champs FSU, dominated them) get? The Capital One Bowl. Not only do they get shut out of the national title last year, they get shut out of the BCS this year!
Now do you hear SEC folks complaining? Nope. LSU is gearing up to play Miami. Auburn is getting ready for a good Wisconsin team. Alabama is preparing for their showdown with Texas Tech. You PAC - 10 folks need to learn from the example! Stop complaining, recruit better, hire coaches who actually compare about the defensive side of the ball (as if the worst rushing defense in the country PLAYING IN A PASSING CONFERENCE could have gone 9 - 2 in the SEC), and win some football games! After all, we all saw where complaining got Cal last season. Not only did they lose the Holiday Bowl to the #4 team in the weak Big 12, but they followed it up by going 7 - 4 with no wins over a single team with a winning record (again, you cannot go 7 - 4 in the SEC without beating a team with a winning record ... South Carolina had to beat a good Florida team who beat the SEC AND ACC champs ... TWO BCS SCHOOLS ... to get to 7 - 4). Beat OU, follow it up next season, and you are guaranteed a BCS bowl! Now the same cannot be said for the SEC, who has only had 1 BCS at large bid since the whole system started despite having 3 or 4 teams that finish with 2 losses or fewer and in the BCS top 15 every year! (The PAC - 10, by comparison, has had two despite rarely having multiple strong teams ... who was the second best PAC - 10 team the year Oregon was "screwed" out of a national title bid? That's right ... Stanford, who lost their bowl game to a Georgia Tech team with an interim coach ... not that PAC - 10 fans like to talk about that one much!). Man, then again, maybe the SEC SHOULD start complaining! NAAAAH! We would rather take the superior football any day of the week!
mark said:
posted on December 6, 2005 1:40 PM — 199.208.239.140 — link — abuse?
To Gerald -
Tell me the last two scores between Notre Dame and Philip Fulmer ??????????
But you are right Notre Dame plays no good SEC Teams. But the ones, they do play beat up on LSU !!!!!
As for Ohio State, Texas and Penn State seems to be very good schools to me.
I'll admit that the SEC is getting the short end of the stick this year and that Georgia and LSU have probably the most talent of any schools, excluding Texas and USC, however, talent and on-field productivity are two different things. Lose early and win late has always been the key to voting. People forget what happens in early september, when a team gets rolling in Oct-Nov.
IrishJT said:
posted on December 6, 2005 9:42 PM — 68.62.202.243 — link — abuse?
Gerald:
I love SEC football and my wife is a proud alum of Auburn. I have enough SEC Football magazines in our house to roll Toomer's Corner.With that said, you of all people should know how good teams knock other good teams out of the Top 10. Auburn just emerged into the top 10 in the last few weeks, having lost to an underated GaTech team and the eventual SEC West champ in OT. Is Alabama a top 10 team? Not even close. Is Florida? No. LSU? No. All were though...does that not count for teams like Georgia. They have not beaten a team (currently) in the Top 10 either. Auburn is 9th and the team they beat is 7th (Georgia). In fact, the only top 10 team that beat a currently ranked top 10 team is Miami (VaTech). Your point that Ohio State and Notre Dame haven't beaten a top 10 opponent this year cannot be characterized as "accurate." Both have beaten plenty of teams that were ranked in the top 10. Those losses have, at least in part, contributed to their current decline in the polls and out of the top 10. It happens to very good teams and it happens to over-rated teams.
For instance, LSU is a good team but lost in the SEC championship. Taken differently, when #23 Oklahoma beats the snot of #5 Oregon...the Ducks will fall from their perch into the canine mouth of reality somewhere in the mid-teens.
Good post though, and I appreciate your comments, but let's not go without being intellectually honest about the meaning of playing and defeating ranked teams.
Go Irish!! Go Sooners!! War Eagle!!
everybodyhatesoregon said:
posted on December 9, 2005 11:14 PM — 72.23.99.74 — link — abuse?
i love how everyone thinks that the bcs is soley based on records. the bcs is based on how well teams do, like one team could be 10-2 and another could be 9-3, but if the team that is 10-2 won their games by small margins and the team that's 9-3 destroyed most of the teams they play, then the team that's 9-3 will be ahead(depending on what teams they loose to our blow out)... P.S. Oregon = 8=>O: they like the sausage)
Irish in Fiesta said:
posted on December 30, 2005 3:41 AM — 69.114.100.9 — link — abuse?
Oregon in the Fiesta Bowl? What a joke! The Pac-1 is the weakest division in college football, but you appear strong because you seem to have a conference policy of scheduling NO TOUGH NON-CONFERENCE GAMES! If you take USC out of the Pac-1, they are weaker than the Big Least, which is quite a feat. Meanwhile, Oregon with all of their complaining couldn't even handle the unranked Sooners. If Notre Dame played Oregon, they would have hung 60 on them; it would have been a disgrace. At least Notre Dame-Ohio State will be a football game.
Columbus can burn in hell and not in celebration. Go Irish, beat Buckeyes.
Gerald said:
posted on December 30, 2005 12:01 PM — 216.113.128.239 — link — abuse?
Irish in Fiesta:
Before you get all cheeky, realize that you guys beat 3 teams, Michigan, BYU, and Navy, that make bowl games. Good for you, Navy won. But BYU and Michigan LOST! AND YOU ONLY BEAT MICHIGAN BY SEVEN POINTS! AND YOU NEEDED A GOAL LINE STAND TO DO THAT! AND RB LEON HART DIDN'T EVEN PLAY! GEE, DON'T YOU THINK THAT MICHIGAN WOULD HAVE SCORED MORE THAN 10 POINTS IF THEY HAD HART? DON'T YOU THINK THAT HART JUST MIGHT HAVE GOTTEN THE BALL INTO THE END ZONE ON DURING THAT GOAL LINE STAND?
As it is, Notre Dame beat two teams that finished with winning records. One of those teams finished 7 - 5, and the other was NAVY. You guys better do well for yourselves against Ohio State, because if you do not, all of the 9 - 2 and 10 - 2 teams in the country are going to be bashing you guys right up until next season, and what is more they will have a point! Like Cal two seasons ago, you guys are solely living off playing USC tough. So what? 7 - 5 ASU (who had to pull out a win against RUTGERS!) and the 3rd place team in the WAC played USC tough. Unless you guys do what Cal and Oregon did not and show up in the bowl game after your only good season in years, the only difference between you guys and Cal is that you guys got the BCS bowl bid and they didn't.
And I am not as impressed with Ohio State as everyone else. They barely got by Michigan (although Michigan DID have Hart in that game), and basically gave away games to Texas and Penn State due to their bumbling. Also, one of Ohio State's 3 great linebackers may not play. If you guys are actually any good, then there will be NO EXCUSE for you to get blown out! All Oregon losing means is that the first fraud check failed. You guys are fraud check #2, and you had better pass! And I am not a Notre Dame basher mind you. I am a closet Notre Dame fan living in SEC country. I am very glad that Darius Walker is playing so well for you guys up there, and still steamed that UGA got so high and mighty that they didn't even offer him a scholarship (if they had, he would have gone to UGA). If UGA had a 1200 yard back like Walker, they'd be in the national title game. Oh well ... that is what UGA gets for having an FSU assistant running their program, because FSU doesn't run the ball either. FSU recruited Lorenzo Booker away from ND to have him sit on the bench? Real nice ...
Notre Dame Fan 444 said:
posted on December 30, 2005 1:30 PM — 199.208.239.140 — link — abuse?
Where are all the "Oregon trail" boyz at this morning.........We have a 10-1 record, we are better then Notre Dame, We beat Stanford by more then you !!! Blah, Blah, Blah......Silence speaks louder then words.
Oregon talks about ND's uniforms and makes fun of the "Green Jerseys". What's up with knee pads on the ducks ????
As for the ND vs Ohio State game. I'm not making any crazy predictions but I feel confident in ND's chances. Everyone is saying ND will get blown out, haven't seen it this year. Not even from the "Greatest Team" in ESPNs history. They needed a little "push". USC is a great team but if they are the "greatest Team in ESPN History", what happens if Texas beats them ???? Do we then have ESPN drum up another 10 teams to play Texas. Or do we just say congrats to Mack Brown and listen to USC say they got lucky or USC played a bad game. That seemed to be the sentiment from all the USC fans when Bush applied the "push". The Grass was to high !!!! Our QB had a bad game !!! Slow start !!!! Hey how about reversing the schedule and have ND play at USC in early October and USC come to South Bend the Last Saturday in November........
One month to prepare for one team - looks like Ohio State Linebackers are going to be really busy !!! constant 4 wideouts and no huddle like they did against, Michigan, Tennessee will surely put an end to that blitzing. And as long as Mark May keeps routing against ND, I feel good about ND's chances !!!!!jrock919 said:
posted on December 30, 2005 5:51 PM — 209.221.40.45 — link — abuse?
Yeah yeah yeah. Oregan lost. duh. But Gerald, UGA doesn't have anybody with that many rushing yards is because they play their backs kinda evenly. They have at least 3 that can get the job done. And UGA is gonna climb a lil after they beat WVA even more tnanks to the ducks. And the ducks wanted a BCS bowl. Please. They lucky to just play a halfway decent team. And lose. UGA is gonna win the Sugar Bowl. Sorry WVA fans.You can't run like that on us. Go DAWGS!!!
The Mayor said:
posted on December 30, 2005 11:07 PM — 24.23.202.200 — link — abuse?
Hey, easy there boys, I just got back from the trip to the game in San Diego and haven't had time to log in and take my lumps.
It's official, I admit on fanblogs.com, in front of all you Duck haters...At #6 The Ducks showed they were over-rated, yes OVER-RATED. There, are you happy with my pain?
It's ok, we'll live. But we weren't on any ones charts back in August and I feel proud of a 10-2 season and probably a mid-teen national ranking. Beats last season's 5-6.
Point of fact: I never said Oregon was better than Notre Dame, I just pointed out the the additional facts that were over looked in the attacks by some of the Irish fans against Oregon and the Pac-10.
The Pac-10 is 3-1 in Bowl games this year with only USC left to play. If they beat Texas, I guess even that won't be enough for the Pac-10 bashers.
I want to go on record as saying the Oklahoma fans in San Diego showed a ton of class...I'm sorry I didn't get to buy drinks for each of them, but I did send more than a few cocktails out to the Sooner nation that stayed at my Hotel.
Is it just me or does anyone else out there notice that post gameday hangovers hurt a lot more if your team loses?
Go Ducks!
Marc Pierson said:
posted on December 31, 2005 12:13 PM — 143.115.159.53 — link — abuse?
I have no problem with OR, being a ND Subway Alumni, but the fact is is that OR's only guarantee to a BCS bowl was if they won their conference, which they did not. That is the only stipulation, just ask FSU and their 8-4 record. ND had to not only win atleast 9 games, which they did, but they also had to be in the top 6 teams in the BCS polls, which again they did. You have a FSU team ranked #22 at 8-4 that took your BCS spot, not ND. We fulfilled our requirement, OR did not. This is what you, as well all other teams in a conference have agreed to be the way in to a BCS game, have agreed to. You signed the paperwork saying that if you win your conference, you get in. Deal with it. If you want the best and highest rated teams to be in the BCS games, change the contract. Oh and by the way, yes, ND lost 2 games to ORs 1. True. However, OR needs to schedule teams that are in IA instead of easy IIA teams like Montana State for Christ Sakes. You can't tell me that a 6-5 Montana team is better than a 5-6 TN team that boasts the 12th highest defense in the nation. Come on.
manpod said:
posted on January 2, 2006 11:06 PM — 24.147.44.172 — link — abuse?
Notre Dame played to its level. A good team, but not a BCS team. A team that has many of is fans in the booth. Brent was holding his blue and gold pom-poms until the last minute of play. Even claming that Notre Tame had a tough schedule this year.
I'm sure ND made the ratings, and many Tostitos were sold.
The Mayor said:
posted on January 3, 2006 4:25 PM — 24.23.202.200 — link — abuse?
It's awful quiet out there. Where are all of the Notre Dame fans this morning?
Irish JT, Notre Dame 444, NDDon, Bob Sharer, Bill Rocklin, Irishman, locondfan11 and the rest...let's hear your thoughts on The Fiesta Bowl game?
The Filthy Fiddler said:
posted on January 4, 2006 11:16 AM — 128.146.151.138 — link — abuse?
Eight consecutive bowl losses. Wow!!! I seem to recall that this ties the all time record. Ha, ha, ha. I can't wait 'til next year when they break it!
I was actually in a bowl pool where I was asked to pick each game and rate my picks in terms of confidence. Guess which pick I was most confident about? Oh yeah. There was no question that a team as one-dimensional and overrated as Notre Dame was going to get its butt kicked by a Big Ten powerhouse. Nice job beating Navy and BYU, by the way. You guys really deserved to be in a BCS bowl.
The whole ND football team should be forced to fly to Eugene to personally apologize to the entire University of Oregon community.
The Mayor said:
posted on January 4, 2006 10:35 PM — 24.23.202.200 — link — abuse?
mr. waitandsee
You're a great fan, probably an alumni of the great University. Good luck to the Irish in 2006. Some of my posts didn't make it either, I think the boys are at the Rose Bowl today rather than checking blogs? I can't blame them.
ThE bUcKeYe BoIz said:
posted on June 5, 2006 12:04 AM — 65.27.227.203 — link — abuse?
hmm....
Do i even have to say how overated ND is? No seriously, they are so overrated its unbelievable. Preseason magazines came out recently and i checked them out and bought a few...
Guess who is number one?
Come on i bet you can...ND got choosen, sadly, though i am impressed with ESPN's rankings that seem a little more realistic. I dont mean to say this mean, but ND isnt good. They arent bad either. Not number one. Clearly below the BCS line.
One day when i met a few ND fans i happend to ask them the score of the Fiesta Bowl, which they replied with telling me tales of the early 1900's glory days and the time charlie weis tried to "eat-i mean beat USC" but it didnt happen. They all said, "ND gave USC the best game they have had in two years."
My response was, "tOSU gave Texas, the national champs, the best game they have had all year."
'
From here on out our conversation got ugly and i shall refuse to use such profane language on this website... :) :) :) :() lol good luck next year ND, youre gonna need it, and go buckeyes...And refering to the ND almost beat USC thing,
Close only counts in horseshoes and handgrenades, and rocket launchers and such but mostly only horseshoes and handgrenades... lol
So Cal USMCr said:
posted on June 10, 2006 7:21 PM — 204.62.68.23 — link — abuse?
BuCkeYes bloz, ND has the most starting talent returning comared to other contenders out there. And generally speaking the biggest Coaching improvement is from the 1st to the 2nd season... Weis is legit, ND is legit. Not all the preseason prognosticators have em No. 1... not all Las Vegas Books give them the best odds... but theyre in the mix - and should be.
And btw, when all was said and done, USC's toughest game was Texas and vice versa.
samuel david said:
posted on June 15, 2006 11:24 PM — 221.164.246.82 — link — abuse?
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Best regards!OU Fan said:
posted on August 13, 2006 12:18 AM — 69.179.196.245 — link — abuse?
I hate ND. Adrian Peterson will win the Heisman. Brady Quinn is not that great in my opinion, way overrated. I like Slaton from West Virginia better than Brady Quinn. I like Paul Smith from Tulsa h#ll of a lot better than Quinn. Go Sooners!!! ND will lose to Georgia Tech and USC.
usdirish said:
posted on August 15, 2006 2:02 PM — 155.104.239.16 — link — abuse?
Take off the blinders OU Fan. At least try to make an impartial statement. Yes, everyone is wrong but you...Brady Quinn just isn't that good. Get a clue. Congrats on being an OU Fan, that doesn't mean you can't look at other teams and recognize the talent there, denying that talent is puerile.
Cheers
Bring Brady Back MgoBlue said:
posted on October 8, 2006 4:52 PM — 216.46.211.238 — link — abuse?
Michigan 47
Notre Dame 21 (misplaced irish of HOOSIER LAND)Wisconsin and Minnesota gave Michigan better games than Notre Dame.
Michigan 31
Michigan State 13Notre Dame 40
Michigan State 37these scores say it all =) Michigan is better than the misplaced irish of HOOSIER LAND! So if Notre Dame is BCS talent then Michigan must be NC talent.
This year the big ten overall is not as good as last year. (Big Ten Standings)
T-1 - Ohio State
T-1 - Michigan
T-3 - Wisconsin
T-3 - Iowa
I think at this point Michigan and Ohio State make up #1 and #2 and Iowa and Wisconsin will fight for third. I would put Penn State on the list but they have really struggled with their QB,Some think their QB is OK,but I think he is a big reason for their losses.IrishJT said:
posted on October 9, 2006 8:12 PM — 71.207.226.16 — link — abuse?
BringBackBrady,
living in the past is obviously something that you cherish (screen name and all). however, i think maybe you've forgotten that a NC run is done over a season, not one game in south bend that was not the irish's best game and michigan came out perfect. i DO believe that michigan, should they go 12-0, will no doubt be in the big game. but have you honestly dismissed the possibility that #9 irish could climb to three before the UM/OSU game? it certainly is possible. if ND wins out, based on the fact that many of the teams in front of them play other teams in front of them (OSU/UM; UL/WVU) and Florida will lose (at least twice), is it so hard to believe that ND is NOT out of the national title here in week 6? also, if ND wins out or even loses to USC, and Brady continues to throw for 3 and 300, lock up our 8th Heisman baby. Henne, Smith, Leak, Hart, Wolfe??? come on. Henne has no body of work. Smith came into the season a favorite because of what he can do on his feet (he has less than 80 yds rushing on the season and barely 1000 passing). Leak is benched every time there is a critical play for a true freshman. Wolfe doesn't play anyone and hasn't shined since OSU against sub-par competition.let's be honest. notre dame's schedule is solid. there are no D-II teams or MAC-type teams (hello Chippewas!) on their schedule. it was the sixth week of the season BEFORE notre dame actually played a team with a loss. all others were undefeated.
an 11-1 notre dame team could easily find themselves in the BCS game, boasting of their newly crowned Heisman trophy winner. that's 8. that's the record.
easternfan said:
posted on October 10, 2006 7:34 AM — 67.72.98.93 — link — abuse?
If by some touchdown Jesus miracle ND finishes 11-1, Irishjt, they will get crushed by their BCS bowl competion like they did last year. ND doesnt have a good o-line, a sorry running game and a suspect defense. Good luck, ask the pope to pray. You guys are a top-25 but nowhere near a top 10 contender.
M GO BLUE said:
posted on October 10, 2006 11:02 AM — 216.46.210.48 — link — abuse?
I am no longer living in the past! From now on I am simply M GO BLUE! Congratulations you convinced me to change my name.....well not my real name.
Listen irish jt,I thought maybe the irish were overrated after Michigan beat them,but they have not lost since and I don't see anyone on the schedule that can beat them untill USC,and I will say the irish outplayed and beat USC last year! The reason people are downplaying the irish is becouse if the irish are BCS talent it means the Wolverines are NC talent,and it's not Michigan's turn to be good.
But for those who do not like Michigan,they still could fall to Penn State or Iowa before the Ohio State game.......does anyone remember the Ohio State game last year? Michigan was up 21-12 with less than 7 minutes to play.........and it happened for the fourth time last year.......
But Michigan is better this year........
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Diggs the Mountie said:
posted on November 27, 2005 12:54 PM — 68.32.21.120 — link — abuse?Go Buckeyes!!!!!