November 14, 2006
Jeff Bowden resigns as Florida State OC
Santa came early for many Florida State football fans: 'Noles Offensive Coordinator Jeff Bowden has resigned. Under a deal reached with the university, Jeff Bowden will stay at FSU in another role outside the athletic department.
During a press conference this afternoon, Director of Athletics Dave Hart announced that Jeff Bowden has stepped down as FSU's offensive coordinator. According to Hart, he will continue to coach at least through the season finale versus Florida and then will be "reassigned" to a position outside the athletic department."Jeff initiated this conversation with me over the course of the last couple of days or so," Hart said. "There was mutual understanding and agreement that this decision was in the best interest of all concerned and that a public announcement should be expedited for all concerned.
"Jeff will be reassigned outside of the department of athletics and will finish his existing contract term which runs through August."
During the press conference (entire transcript available at Warchant.com), Jeff Bowden said that he believed that he was doing what was best for his family and his father.
... Twenty-five-plus years ago, he taught myself and a lot of players that have come through here to do what is right. And that's the reason I'm here, because I believe in my heart that, for Bobby Bowden, this is a decision I need to make and for myself and my family, maybe the most important, this is a decision I need to make for my family. I want to thank y'all. Florida State has the greatest fans in the country. I could not be happier with the future that this team has. I could not be happier that I had this opportunity, but it's just time for me to move on now. I just hope the next guy that comes in can close this deal for this program. Thank you.
According to FSU AD Dave Hart, Jeff Bowden has come to him several times this season, most recently after the Wake Forest game. Jeff Bowden gave Hart his resignation, but Bobby Bowden was not involved in the decision or negotiations related to Jeff staying on in any other capacity.
Bowden -- youngest son of head coach Bobby Bowden -- retains his present $141,000 salary until his contract expires next August. He then will receive annual payments of $107,500 until August 2012.
Head Coach Bobby Bowden released a short statement saying that he was disappointed about the decision and didn't want to discuss Jeff's choice.
"I am disappointed in Jeff's decision. I tried my best to encourage him to stay the course, but he was firm in his belief that it is time to move on. This is a big loss to me personally. I would hope that everyone understands that his decision is an emotional one for me and for that reason I'm not going to discuss it any further at this time."
Warchant.com publisher Gene Williams introduced a quick list of five potential candidates to replace Jeff Bowden at Florida State:
Chris Hatcher Current job: Head coach Valdosta State Valdosta State's all-time winningest football coach and oversees the offense. A disciple of Hal Mumme, Hatcher's system, called the Air Raid offense, has been arguably the most prolific in Division-II football over the past few years. Hatcher's six-year record at VSU is 68-10 (.870 winning percentage). He also reached the ultimate goal in 2004 when he won a national championship. FSU Ties: Has been around the program for years and involved in several coaching clinics and camps. Is friends with FSU Executive Head Coach and Linebackers Coach Kevin Steele, who's son plays at Valdosta State. Hatcher was in attendance for Saturday's FSU-Wake Forest game.Has been around the program for years and involved in several coaching clinics and camps.
Larry Fedora
Current job: Offensive Coordinator and QB coach at Oklahoma State
Resume: Has 16 seasons of coaching at the collegiate level. His 2004 Florida offense ranked first in the SEC in six categories: passing offense (271.1 ypg), total offense (426.9 ypg), third-down conversion percentage (47.8), touchdown passes (29), pass attempts (407) and pass completions (243). Prior to his stint at Florida, the 44-year old coach served as Middle Tennessee's offensive coordinator, producing one of the nation's most prolific offenses.
FSU Ties: Coached under FSU executive head coach and linebackers coach Kevin Steele at Baylor. Also, coached at Florida under Ron Zook from 2002-04.
Jimbo Fisher
Current job: Offensive Coordinator and QB coach at LSU
Resume: Generally considered one of college football's top offensive minds, while also serving as one of the school's top recruiters. Fisher has been a part of 59 victories, two SEC titles and the 2003 National Championship. The 41-year old coach engineered one of the nation's most potent offensive attacks at Cincinnati in 1999 (averaged 424.4 yards of total offense).
FSU Ties: Served as the quarterbacks coach at Auburn under Terry Bowden from 1993-98. He also served as the offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach at Samford for two years (1991-92) before joining Auburn with Terry Bowden. He also played quarterback for Terry Bowden for three seasons, two at Salem College (1985-86) and one at Samford (1987).
George Henshaw
Current job: Senior Offensive Assistant/Running Backs coach for the New Orleans Saints
Resume: Has been an assistant coach in the NFL working with offenses for the past 18 years and has been in coaching for 36 seasons. During that span, Henshaw has tutored nearly every position group on offense, served as an assistant head coach, and as an offensive coordinator. Prior to New Orleans, the 58-year old coach spent nine seasons (1997-2005) with the Tennessee Titans, the last six as assistant head coach/offense. In that position, Henshaw assisted in game-planning the team's offensive attack.
FSU Ties: Coached under Bowden at both West Virginia (1970-75) and Florida State (1976-82) working as both the offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach. His son, Matt Henshaw, played for Bobby Bowden and the Seminoles from 2001-2005.
Brad Scott
Current job: Clemson assistant head coach, Offensive line coach
Resume: During Scott's tenure, Clemson has recorded six of its top-10 total offensive seasons in history. Served as offensive coordinator from 2000-03, and Clemson produced three of the top-six seasons in school history in total offense during that time. The 2003 team gained 5,467 yards, most in school history. Records were also established for passing yards, completions, and touchdown passes.
FSU Ties: Scott was on Bobby Bowden's staff at FSU for 11 years. The Seminoles went 10-0-1 in bowl games during that time. He spent his last four years as the offensive coordinator and OL coach. Those four years included FSU's 1993 National Championship season and a record-setting offense that featured Heisman Trophy winner Charlie Ward. Florida State posted a 44-6 (.880) record.
Brad Scott's return to FSU would be a very welcome occurance, and probably the most likely of these five. That said, give me Jimbo Fisher - of this five - if you can convince him to jump from the SEC. Fisher is not currently being talked about for a head coaching job, but it's likely that he could get some looks at head coach rather than an OC position.
And, as I'm sure several comments will point out - there's this guy with the Tennessee Titans that you might have heard of named Norm Chow. To get Chow (((long shot))) to take the FSU OC position, I think you have to promise him the top job on a definite timetable, as there are already head coaching jobs on the West Coast that would interest Chow.
I'd like to give big props to Warchant.com for having the inside line on the Bowden announcement this morning and to Every Day Should Be Saturday for being the first CFB blog to post it.
Comments:
Jon said:
posted on November 14, 2006 9:56 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
First off, I'd like to thank everyone who has stood with us making noise, bringing this issue to the forefront of the media over the past few years. They said our opinions were irrelevant... They said the boosters had no say... But it looks like we showed them! (this ones for you Joe..)
Second (and I hope I'm not alone on this issue), the mutiny is over. We fully support Bowden restoring this program with a new offensive coordinator. The majority of fans had issues with Jeff. The issues with Bobby only came when he created an ultimatum. I really hope Bobby continues with the program, because he does deserve to go out on top and he WILL GO OUT ON TOP.
And lastly, I'd like to see Jeff Bowden stays on the staff and go back to wide receiver coach. Maybe he can learn under this new offensive coordinator and maybe he will return one day and be successful.
It's a wonderful day to be a Seminole! Lets unite, stand together and show W. Michigan and Florida that this is our house.
You guys kick ass!!
Jon said:
posted on November 14, 2006 10:18 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
I submit my way of finding a new offensive coordinator.
1) Take the statistics.
2) Find the leaders in total offense.
3) Weight it accordingly... (how many years have they proven themselves)
4) Hire the best person who is willing to come to us...After we share a secret with them....which is...if they are successful...they will inherit the keys to the kingdom...(shortly)I think we need to focus on hiring the best person for the job.. not hiring an "old familiar name"
Joe said:
posted on November 14, 2006 10:39 PM — 72.185.22.184 — link — abuse?
Jon,
Don't flatter yourself.. You are a total embarrassment to FSU and continue to be. That you would attempt to force Bowden to fire his son shows truly you lack the very thing the Bobby Bowden has stood for. Jeff is gone. His decision. I have read no where that he said listening to the fans, and sign holders were the reason for his decision. He was the scapegoat that ignorant fans like you constantly ridiculed as the blame for everything. Guess you will be searching for a new one. I imagine the first loss and it will be right back after Bobby again. So ignorant and stupid.
I have never felt that Jeff was any more than an average OC at FSU. I am happy that Jeff made his decision to step down. As a son he showed his love for his father, something that the shrill classless booing and sign carrying types never will understand.
I imagine the next crusade will be who FSU's starting QB and RB should be. What a miserable time Chris Rix had. It is my hope that one day most "bandwagoners" will jump off. True fans support win or lose.
Personally, I blame the lack of quick changes happening because of fans like yourself.
When you push and disrespect a "legend" the changes occur much slower.
It was fans like you that pushed Bilichick out of Cleveland. New England certainly was happy with that decision.
I am just thankful that Jeff made the decision and not some stupid spoiled self-entitled fans that utter such classics as "WHY WOULD ANY RECRUIT WANT TO COME TO FSU?" Might as well get on the UF payroll.Kage said:
posted on November 14, 2006 11:38 PM — 71.229.26.75 — link — abuse?
I agree with u Jon that Jeff can stay @ Wide Recievers coach, but certainly not OC. The Buzz I've heard is about the Valdosta State coach that took Fabian Walker from FSU n won the D-II title. Chris Hatcher is the name of the Valdosta Sate coach, which somehow has some ties to Bobby
Joe said:
posted on November 15, 2006 5:37 AM — 72.185.22.184 — link — abuse?
Statistics are for losers
You hire an offensive mind that not only is a good game strategist, but knows how to develop character, loyalty,and teamwork. You hire a tireless recruiter that parents can trust that their son won't be treated like another piece of meat. You hire a coach that is familiar with the FSU offense and will utilize it to make it more efficient. Also you pick a coach that will utilize a players talent in such a way that he is put in a position to succeed.
The worst thing FSU could do is hire someone that is not congruent with what has made FSU the success it has been in the past. The hire or who knows? possibly hires should be those that understands the "BOWDEN" way. His record but more importantly his values are what has made FSU what it is today.Ash said:
posted on November 15, 2006 6:17 AM — 69.21.116.14 — link — abuse?
I agree with Jon, in that now we must present a united front in our support of Coach Bowden, as I have always said it is not his head I wanted. I want him to retire not in disgrace but in jubilation. We need to understand that the legacy he leaves (when he leaves) must endure for all time. I also agree that if we can convince Jeff to stay on as Wide Receiver Coach (a position that he filled admirably) would be best for the team and Florida State overall.
However one area where I do disagree with him is, the person that takes over this position needs also to be a very strong recruiter, an area where sometimes a name is what’s needed. But I also agree that only way we will get one of the top offensive minds is with the understanding that shortly they will take over the program. It looks very good that Chris Hatcher, may be our next Offensive Coordinator, however before the powers that be make a decision I have a name they may want to look at Paul Petrino, Louisville’s Offensive Coordinator, who may be convinced to jump ship if it was understood that he was the heir apparent, and is a name.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on November 15, 2006 8:33 AM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Eh... Joe, don't be so hard on Jon. He's got the right idea.
I am firmly in favor of Bowden running the selection process and choosing his own OC for his own reason. The man is a living legend. No one -- including the athletic director, who wouldn't even have an athletic department worth ten cents without Bowden's life achievements -- should try to worm their way into Bowden's head and influence his decision.
I think FSU needs another Bowden-like guy at OC. Not to say Jeff was good, because he wasn't. But we need to see a guy who Bobby knows and trusts. Stats and numbers don't mean all that much. Trust is what matters. History is what matters. If Bowden trusts the new guy -- things will be good for the Noles. This might even be a golden opportunity to promote from within.
Chow would be an awful fit at FSU. I am sure he would be unhappy there, and Bowden would probably be unhappy with him. Can you imagine the "Southern Gentleman" and "King Bowden" himself having to share the stage with a brilliant offensive mind? Fur would fly. Better to let Bowden bask in the glow of the spotlight.
Joe said:
posted on November 15, 2006 8:33 AM — 72.185.22.184 — link — abuse?
This article states it all and expresses what truly FSU fans mindset should be at this time.
The "grass isn't always greener". Bowden is what he is but a certain group of silly, spoiled, and yes ignorant FSU fans played a most dangerous game of Russian Roulette with the winningest coach in CFB history. As you read the article think of why Bobby would refuse his son's requestto resign a year ago?
The answer lies in some fans insulting and foolish entitlement issues. You backed a legend into a corner and should have just shut up and JB would have left a lot sooner.
It is all about understanding the Bowden way. Personally I have found it the most appealing thing about FSU and its Football team.Link- required reading for FSU fans!
http://www.sptimes.com/2006/11/15/Sports/For_FSU__time_is_righ.shtml
JZNole said:
posted on November 15, 2006 10:56 AM — 12.177.80.3 — link — abuse?
Sounds like Joe is over-reacting a little. I agree with Jon here. Obviously Jeff Bowden is going to admit that he's resigning because the fans are "getting to him". From what I've heard he's actually tried to resign a few times over the last few years but Bobby wouldn't let him. Kudos to Jeff for going straight to Dave Hart this time.
As for a replacement, I think it might be better of if he had NO ties to FSU. Why would we want someone familiar with the FSU offense when we've been horrible the last 6 years?
I agree with Kevin, the only way we have a shot at Norm Chow is to promise him the keys when Bobby finally does retire (on his own terms).
Go 'Noles! This won't fix the problem overnight, but its one he!l of a start!!!!
mudpuppy said:
posted on November 15, 2006 11:22 AM — 72.154.158.239 — link — abuse?
The thing that is disappointing about Bobby & Jeff is that it became personal. FSU is a state university and football is big business. The FSU football program needs to be run like a business and if you don't get results then you need to get someone who can. I have been a Bobby fan from the beginning - but he has lost sight of the big picture here. In the long run FSU will be much better off, I hope Bobby can come to grips with that. If not, then it is time to retire and bask in the honors that he deserves for all those wonderful years.
Joe said:
posted on November 15, 2006 12:18 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
Gator hippy,
That you make such a disparaging remark about Bowden is totally predictable from a gator fan.
Suggest you read Romano's article in today's St Pete Times twice.. Hopefully, you will grasp the concept of the "Bowden Way"..
You quite obviously don't have a clue, and more disturbingly from you dialogue don't ascribe to the same values Bowden does. JMO but that is sad.
I guess that is called "BEING A GATOR" LOL
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 15, 2006 2:30 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
I guess, Joe...though I don't necessarily find it disparaging...more truthful and reportive of the facts...
Joe, nobody needed a clue to see what was happening to FSU with Jeffy at the helm...
It was vividly apparent to everyone in the country, including Bowden IMHO, but he was too stubborn to initiate the change himself...
In a professional environment leaders must subscribe people to their list sets of values in order to be effective and can't allow nepotism, egotism, and arrogance affect their decision making in that environment...
At this point Bobby's personal values have overinfluenced Bobby's professional values and drug the FSU program to the dismal low it's at right now...
And that was the problem with promoting Jeff to OC and the lack of action as it only got worse...
Bad PROFESSIONAL decision making...I commend Bowden for being a devout Christian and striving to bring those that want it to the same personal level of spirituality that he enjoys...
But in a professional environment you have to make a seperation between personal feelings and sound decision making...
And, Joe?
Usually when one veers from the issue and resorts to personal attacks it is a true sign of slipping onto the losing end of the debate at hand...
Joe said:
posted on November 15, 2006 4:12 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
Like I stated read the linked article:
I guess we just look at the game of college football differently. I believe the writer understands what Bowden means to the program.
Likewise a fan of the "UNIVERSITY OF HELL YES WE CHEAT" would never be expected to understand, and I apologise for trying to change any gator fan's mind on this.
FSU doesn't operate like UF and I for one am extremely thankful for that.
Lest anyone forget the NCAA's opinion of UF in 1985...
UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA PLACED ON NCAA PROBATION
"Unfortunately, during the five-year period in which the violations occurred," continued Mr. Toner, "the football coaching staff operated unimpeded by any effort being exerted by the university's director of athletics or any other administrative authority at the university to assure control of the football program. Due to this fact, as well as the serious nature of many of the violations in this case, the Committee on Infractions and the Council considered this to be among the most serious infractions cases ever processed by the NCAA.”
Again I apologize gator hippy.. It is a Nole Thing" and you wouldn't understand. (if I may borrow the usual rhetoric thrown out by gator fans when they are asked to explain questionable behavior.)
Hey don't shoot the messenger! Who is veering?I stand behind Bowden and what he has stood for you don't. Obviously, we disagree.
http://www.sptimes.com/2006/11/15/Sports/For_FSU__time_is_righ.shtml
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 15, 2006 5:07 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
"I guess we just look at the game of college football differently."
Who is we, Joe?
As you normally ask of others as this argument has grown...
What have YOU done for FSU football?
I seem to remember you stating you never even attended the school...
And as usual and on cue, you want to bring up the probation issues again, which have nothing to do with this thread...
So it's a Nole thing to make poor managerial decisions at a high leadership level?
To allow incompetence to run wild on a mangerial staff for several years dragging the product down with it?
C'mon, Joe, you can't really belive that...
Gatorpilot said:
posted on November 15, 2006 5:40 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Ah, the Bowden Way.
Does that include taking payoffs to do the right thing? I suppose it must.
Ho, ho, ho. These are good times. Joe's flustered and flummoxed, the Seminole "Nation" is in total disarray... man. I hope it lasts forever.
ASH said:
posted on November 15, 2006 5:59 PM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
The acceptance of mediocrity should never be tolerated in anything, to say someone is not a true fan because they are not willing to wait for a team to get better is a very unsound philosophy. It is my understanding (I may be wrong), that football is just a game, of which the main objective is to win. If it’s not then why keep score, and if your not winning then why play the game? In collage football the secondary objective is to win the National Championship, if you take care of the first the second will naturally follow.
If a team, known for winning suddenly slips into mediocrity, you naturally look for the reasons as to why this happing. A first its easy to go to the old blame standards, it’s a rebuilding year, it couldn’t last forever, the talent isn’t what it use to be, and recruits are going to other collages because they can start now. As the trend continues the blames get more sophisticated, if we just get a better quarterback, our wide receivers aren’t what they use to be, if we hadn’t missed that field goal, and their defense is better then we thought. The more the trend continues the less blames are thrown out and hallucinatory optimism sets in, wait tell next year. Tell finally after six years of mediocrity you face reality, and the only constant through out the mediocre( which means by the way adequate but not very good) years, Jeff Bowden.
Joe I’m not sure why you have such unwavering loyalty to Coach Bowden and his son, but it is admirable, however to say that those of us who find mediocrity unacceptable because we want better then average, because we don’t want Coach Bowden’s legacy destroyed by inadequacy, is truly unfair. I’m sure that there were many who stood by Nero while Rome burned, that later wish they hadn’t. But to say fan’s like Jon shouldn’t “flatter yourself.. You are a total embarrassment to FSU and continue to be. That you would attempt to force Bowden to fire his son shows truly you lack the very thing the Bobby Bowden has stood for. Jeff is gone. His decision. I have read no where that he said listening to the fans, and sign holders were the reason for his decision. He was the scapegoat that ignorant fans like you constantly ridiculed as the blame for everything. Guess you will be searching for a new one. I imagine the first loss and it will be right back after Bobby again. So ignorant and stupid.” shows that you are willing to accept mediocrity, but don’t ridicule us, don’t demean us, or cast dispersions against us, because we wanted more then average, because we wanted the national championship to be ours for the loosing, because we want Coach Bowden to go out into that good night with all glory and acclaim that is his right and distinction.
I may not be your type of fan Joe but I hope that me and those like me are always around to insure that winning and not mediocrity is the standard that FSU always plays for. And just once more for the record, we never wanted Coach Bowden to leave, we just didn’t want him to ignore us.
Joe said:
posted on November 15, 2006 6:09 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
We is You and myself.
Again, I suggest you read the article..
As to the question? I am nothing more than a fan of FSU. Whether I donate $10,000 or 10 Million that would never be an issue. Again, I understand that this is a foreign concept to you, whom I guess feels the Gators owe you something?It is just a game to me and though I want FSU to win them all if they don't it doesn't end my world.
The NCAA quote is most appropriate because you have never seen nor ever will see such a quote attributed to FSU under Bowden.
It is all about family, loyalty, and decency. Those are qualities I have always admired with Bobby or anyone for that matter.
Your entitled to your opinion. The fact that we differ I find most comforting. Kind of separates us as fans. I am indeed grateful for that difference.
ash said:
posted on November 15, 2006 6:21 PM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
The acceptance of mediocrity should never be tolerated in anything, to say someone is not a true fan because they are not willing to wait for a team to get better is a very unsound philosophy. It is my understanding (I may be wrong), that football is just a game, of which the main objective is to win. If it’s not then why keep score, and if your not winning then why play the game? In collage football the secondary objective is to win the National Championship, if you take care of the first the second will naturally follow.
If a team, known for winning suddenly slips into mediocrity, you naturally look for the reasons as to why this happing. A first its easy to go to the old blame standards, it’s a rebuilding year, it couldn’t last forever, the talent isn’t what it use to be, and recruits are going to other collages because they can start now. As the trend continues the blames get more sophisticated, if we just get a better quarterback, our wide receivers aren’t what they use to be, if we hadn’t missed that field goal, and their defense is better then we thought. The more the trend continues the less blames are thrown out and hallucinatory optimism sets in, wait tell next year. Tell finally after six years of mediocrity you face reality, and the only constant through out the mediocre( which means by the way adequate but not very good) years, Jeff Bowden.
Joe I’m not sure why you have such unwavering loyalty to Coach Bowden and his son, but it is admirable, however to say that those of us who find mediocrity unacceptable because we want better then average, because we don’t want Coach Bowden’s legacy destroyed by inadequacy, is truly unfair. I’m sure that there were many who stood by Nero while Rome burned, that later wish they hadn’t. But to say fan’s like Jon shouldn’t “flatter yourself.. You are a total embarrassment to FSU and continue to be. That you would attempt to force Bowden to fire his son shows truly you lack the very thing the Bobby Bowden has stood for. Jeff is gone. His decision. I have read no where that he said listening to the fans, and sign holders were the reason for his decision. He was the scapegoat that ignorant fans like you constantly ridiculed as the blame for everything. Guess you will be searching for a new one. I imagine the first loss and it will be right back after Bobby again. So ignorant and stupid.” shows that you are willing to accept mediocrity, but don’t ridicule us, don’t demean us, or cast dispersions against us, because we wanted more then average, because we wanted the national championship to be ours for the loosing, because we want Coach Bowden to go out into that good night with all glory and acclaim that is his right and distinction.
I may not be your type of fan Joe but I hope that me and those like me are always around to insure that winning and not mediocrity is the standard that FSU always plays for. And just once more for the record, we never wanted Coach Bowden to leave, we just didn’t want him to ignore us.
Jon said:
posted on November 15, 2006 7:06 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
Tuesday: "I am disappointed in Jeff's decision," Bobby Bowden said. "I tried my best to encourage him to stay the course, but he was firm in his belief that it is time to move on."
Wednesday: "It's just amazing," Bobby Bowden said Wednesday. "When things go wrong the first thing they blame is the offensive coordinator. That's kind of the game we Americans play."
I have to be honest here... I'm a little worried about Bobby Bowden. These quotes seem bizarre to me... Almost like he has entrenched himself in football, Bush, Fox News, Jesus....
I hope he is not suffering from dementia. :-(
Jon said:
posted on November 15, 2006 7:23 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
Joe - That article does nothing but stroke his ego and make excuses for something that is inexcusable.
From the article:
"Yet, you should also stop to examine it from a father's point of view. A man seeing his greatest accomplishment crushing his youngest son."To Bobby's credit, he valued the love of family over the cost of his reputation. And to Jeff's credit, he could no longer allow his father to take shots for him.
The author needs to remember: Bobby Bowden chose to bear this cross. When you hire a family member, you have to be prepared to judge them objectively. When Bowden was fighting to get his son hired, do you think he told the University that his love would come before the good of the team and doing his job? Unlikely.
Ash said:
posted on November 15, 2006 7:24 PM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
The acceptance of mediocrity should never be tolerated in anything, to say someone is not a true fan because they are not willing to wait for a team to get better is a very unsound philosophy. It is my understanding (I may be wrong), that football is just a game, of which the main objective is to win. If it’s not then why keep score, and if your not winning then why play the game? In collage football the secondary objective is to win the National Championship, if you take care of the first the second will naturally follow.
If a team, known for winning suddenly slips into mediocrity, you naturally look for the reasons as to why this happing. A first its easy to go to the old blame standards, it’s a rebuilding year, it couldn’t last forever, the talent isn’t what it use to be, and recruits are going to other collages because they can start now. As the trend continues the blames get more sophisticated, if we just get a better quarterback, our wide receivers aren’t what they use to be, if we hadn’t missed that field goal, and their defense is better then we thought. The more the trend continues the less blames are thrown out and hallucinatory optimism sets in, wait tell next year. Tell finally after six years of mediocrity you face reality, and the only constant through out the mediocre (which means by the way adequate but not very good) years, Jeff Bowden.
Joe I’m not sure why you have such unwavering loyalty to Coach Bowden and his son, but it is admirable, however to say that those of us who find mediocrity unacceptable because we want better then average, because we don’t want Coach Bowden’s legacy destroyed by inadequacy, is truly unfair. I’m sure that there were many who stood by Nero while Rome burned, that later wish they hadn’t. But to say fan’s like Jon shouldn’t “flatter yourself. You are a total embarrassment to FSU and continue to be. That you would attempt to force Bowden to fire his son shows truly you lack the very thing the Bobby Bowden has stood for. Jeff is gone. His decision. I have read nowhere that he said listening to the fans, and sign holders were the reason for his decision. He was the scapegoat that ignorant fans like you constantly ridiculed as the blame for everything. Guess you will be searching for a new one. I imagine the first loss and it will be right back after Bobby again. So ignorant and stupid.” shows that you are willing to accept mediocrity, but don’t ridicule us, don’t demean us, or cast dispersions against us, because we wanted more then average, because we wanted the national championship to be ours for the loosing, because we want Coach Bowden to go out into that good night with all glory and acclaim that is his right and distinction.
I may not be your type of fan Joe but I hope that me and those like me are always around to insure that winning and not mediocrity is the standard that FSU always plays for. And just once more for the record, we never wanted Coach Bowden to leave; we just didn’t want him to ignore us.
Ash said:
posted on November 16, 2006 8:33 AM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
The time for rhetoric is over Jeff is gone (we hope that he can still lead us to a bowl), and a new era is beginning. Who ever takes over the helm as Offensive Coordinator will need out support as united fans. We gave Jeff six years to bring it around, that’s longer then just bout any other offensive coordinator would ever have been given. We need to be at least as half as patient with the new guy.
One thing that I agree with Joe about is that the final decision of who is the new offensive coordinator should be Bobby’s and no one else’s. It’s his right, he’s more then earned it. I also agree that the new guy should stand for everything Bobby believes in, Chuck and Mark were his prodigies, and look how good they turned out. I think that everyone has it wrong it wasn’t the FSU style of offensive that was the problem, (NC State and Georgia seem to do well with it), it was the fact that we weren’t playing FSU football that was the problem.
But now as the smoke clears and the battle lines move back, we need to unite, for those young men still playing on field, for a great man that we all admire, and for the Garnet and Gold we love. This Saturday we need to fill that stadium and cheer, as loud and as passionately as we have argued. Let’s remind those young men why they choose FSU, lets show our love for Bobby Bowden and lets do it together so that others teams fans know that all is right in Tallahassee.
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 16, 2006 10:14 AM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Gee, Joe...
You left out the part in the Bowden Way about holding out for half a million bucks before one "does the right thing..."
Apparently, the Bowdens are about family, loyalty, decency AND CASH...
The comforting thing is that FSU will be paying for a mistake that should have never happened for the next 6 years...
$500,000 could be used for alot of things at the school I'm sure...
It seems that if the Bowdens are truly the type of people that you and your article claim, Jeff would donate that money back into the athletics program for scholarships, facility upgrades...
Or maybe a signing bonus for a new offensive coordinator...
I'm curious how much of this Bobby really "didn't" know about...
GatorMatt said:
posted on November 16, 2006 10:31 AM — 130.218.254.81 — link — abuse?
I don't know about you guys, but I have a feeling once Florida rolls into Tallatrashy and destroys FSU (so long as Florida remembers that you still have to play offense after halftime), the heat will be back on. Losing to your rival in your own stadium I think is worse than losing to an unranked team in your own stadium. And also, does Bowden even coach anymore? Or does he just stand on the sidelines and watch? I would love to see some changes, b/c I remember a 4 years ago when I was a freshman, and FSU was considered a challenge. Now all they are doing is hurting the Gators strength of schedule
Joe said:
posted on November 16, 2006 12:04 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
Since Jeff got paid rather well, I Guess Jon's Noise making was a bit expensive.. Time will tell if it was money well spent. Truly though it was the best that could be done in a difficult situation.
Jon,Just an observation but don't you find it a bit odd that these gator fans totally agree with your opinion? Hmmm? I believe there is a message there... LOL
JMO but I have never known a gator fan to be anything but a deceitful liar when it came to FSU. Proof of my point? Gator Matts post... "Be careful whom you sleep with" JON.Of course FSU could have handled it the "gator way" and ran JB out on a rail, or had their most legendary coach quit on them, but like I say FSU does things just a bit differently.
I am confident Bobby's choices for staff changes will be good ones. While the jury is out on Mchale( Takes time to institute zone blocking and recruiting those types of lineman), I expect the PlayStation All-Americans will make him the next scapegoat. I think the Steele hire was an excellent choice as he is a great recruiter and LB coach.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on November 16, 2006 12:45 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
As weird as it sounds, FSU has slid so far that we Gators actually need them to pick it up and get it in gear somewhat. It's fun to see them have a bad year or three but they're starting to look more like a D-IAA or even D-II program rather than the former "national champions."
Sort of a yin and yang thing, I guess. The Gator Nation is the light, FSU is the darkness. We need them to be a reasonably powerful foe, with at least a chance of beating us occasionally, for the light to remain bright.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on November 16, 2006 12:59 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Right on, gatorhippy. Joe's really grasping at straws now. :)
JZNole said:
posted on November 16, 2006 1:08 PM — 12.177.80.3 — link — abuse?
Considering how UF has been struggling with such powerhouses like Vandy & South Carolina, its pretty funny that you're talking trash right now. All it can do is come back and bite you (GatorMatt). You guys should take a clue from gatorhippy and learn about class.
With that said, I'm not doubting the fact that it COULD be a UF blowout, hell Wake Forest did it!
But that game will have no impact on any "heat". Jeff Bowden will still be the offensive coordinator, so Bobby will get a free pass until next year.
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 16, 2006 4:59 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
G-Matt:
Those guys got a point...
Gators haven't won squat yet and with only one victory in Tally in the last 20 years...
Well, let's just say nothing's guaranteed...
I mean, the way the Bowdens blackmailed FSU you would think that SEC referees might not be outta their league...
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 16, 2006 5:13 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Yikes, Joe...
You seem okay with the fact that the Bowdens have basically stolen money directly from the coffers of the athletic program and deserving student athletes that could use those funds...
Do you not find it disturbing that Jeffy essentially LIED to the entire world at his press conference claiming his resignation was because of his old man and the lessons and love he has gleened from this upstanding icon?
When in reality it was because they finally offered him enough cash to leave...
Wouldn't the impeccably high ethic and moral standards of the "Bowden Way" truly prevent a person from taking money they haven't earned from the availability of the student athletes it is there to provide for?
Or are the Bowdens "entitled" to this money because Bobby built the program and brought it to where it is today?
Sorry, but yet again the true Bowden colors are starting to glint out from underneath a worn and broken visage...
I hate to tell you this but it's not just Gator fans that agree with Jon...
It's pretty much everybody that follows college football...
As a matter of fact, YOU seem to be in the vast minority when it comes to the Bowdens...
Jon said:
posted on November 16, 2006 6:06 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
I understand the payoff.
Basically his contract was set to expire in August 2006 (which was a stupid move on part of the administration, considering we would never be able to bring in a new OC that late...if you ask me, college football contracts should renew in January or February).
We are basically honoring the contract and paying him the remainder of his salary, which we are probably legally obligated to do...He probably has a buyout clause in his contract and it is probably equivalent to his payoff amount. I mean, there is no way we could of afforded to wait until his contract expires in August. It just came out of booster money instead of University money, to make it more justifiable.
It pissed me off at first, but after considering 1) the contract issue, 2) he would of made roughly the same amount if he continued working until August and 3) we cant hire another coordinator until he is gone...It makes perfectly logical sense.
Jon said:
posted on November 16, 2006 6:14 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
Yah.. I definitely think if we fired him we would of legally had to honor the rest of his contract anyways...or we would of had to pay a buyout clause.
We did him a favor and give him the opportunity to step down and resign on his own terms before it got ugly and dragged his father into it.
Smart move all-around, but not nearly as smart as not hiring him in the first place and defining a clear set of performance objectives.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on November 16, 2006 6:45 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
gatorhippy: All I can say is, I think we're going to be using Joe's "Bowden Way" phrase a LOT here on fanblogs. :)
GatorMatt said:
posted on November 16, 2006 8:18 PM — 65.213.191.153 — link — abuse?
Ash,
If I recall correctly, the last time Florida stepped into Nole Country, the field had just been named "Bobby Bowden field at Doak Campell Stadium," or some long name like that. Ron Zook, RON ZOOK managed to hand FSU a loss. And of course we all remember last years "close game." Now that the Gators have their head on their shoulders, I don't forsee a win for the Seminoles. I realize that talk is cheap, but a 5-5 record is nothing to write home about. Hopefully you guys will get into a bowl game at least. Maybe something called the Credit Union Bowl or something
Ash said:
posted on November 17, 2006 6:07 AM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
GatorMatt,
I'm just saying after Vandy & SC you can't say the Gator's are lock yet. You can talk about the past, but were not playing those games again. Were playing this years and the way Florida is playing (I hate to say) down to thier opponent, Florida State actualy has real chance unless your Coach can wake them up.
Dan C said:
posted on November 17, 2006 7:18 AM — 72.150.174.240 — link — abuse?
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Wrestler79 said:
posted on November 17, 2006 9:39 AM — 70.154.161.209 — link — abuse?
I blame the people at FSU for this, they should have never allowed Bobby to hire his own kids because sooner or later something like this was bound to happen. Nepitism can cause huge problems. I like Jimbo #1, Fedora #2 and Fisher #3.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on November 17, 2006 10:18 AM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Jon, (Post #40)
Not to pick nits, because you seem pretty smart for a 'Nole fan, but I've read that same argument at warchant and it makes no sense. If his salary is $141,000/yr. and was up in August of this year, how does paying him an additional $537,000 "compensate" him in any way for any perceived loss? Additionally, he is going to be assigned outside of the athletic department until his contract is up, so he's not even going to lose any money.
I'm afraid that this $537,000 buyout to leave, which as far as I know is an unenviable first for a Division I-A offensive coordinator, is going to be a badge of shame for FSU's program for the indefinite future. Offensive coordinators are simply fired when they don't perform. Jeff's status as "Baby Bowden" preserved his job in such a way that boosters had to step in and pay him off to leave. Pretty disgusting, no matter how you shake it, but at least you got rid of him.
GatorMatt said:
posted on November 17, 2006 11:07 AM — 130.218.254.81 — link — abuse?
Ash:
I don't like discussing years past, but I felt it was relevant in this situation. Also, in talking about how the Gators have been playing lately, I'll be the first one to say the offense needs to get their heads out of their a$$es. But with the way the Seminoles have been playing is embarassing. Getting shutout at home? That's not supposed to happen to any of Florida's 3 powerhouse teams. I'll take a 9-1 record vs. a 5-5 record any day.
Jon said:
posted on November 17, 2006 11:10 AM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
Gatorpilot -- To be honest with you, I'd really have to read his contract. It is pretty common for coaches to have buyout clauses in their contract. If he has a clause that says something to the effect of: FSU agrees to pay Jeffy 141k over 6 years for being a horrible offensive coordinator. Any early termination of this contract entitles Jeffy to a lump sum buyout payment of 500k.
The catch-22 in his contract is that it expires in August. This means, FSU cannot hire a new offensive coordinator until August, unless they terminate Bowden early. Which means Bowden gets his buyout clause.
So basically.. He resigns (to save face) because he knows he is getting fired.. The boosters end up paying his buyout clause (because using University funds for such would be heavily scrutinized). And FSU gets the power to hire an offensive coordinator earlier than August of next year.
But if I were to take off the rose colored goggles. This would be my real theory:
They paid what they had to get rid of Jeff and pacify Bobby Bowden. There is no way a buyout clause for an offensive coordinator would of been much more than the remainder of his base salary. Bowden was told that his son would have to go and the Boosters did it to pacify him....so he wouldn't throw the hissy fit and retire (like he assured us he would)... So now daddy doesn't have to worry about little Jeffy paying his bills..
Now consider this...
1) Bobby Bowden is responsible for generating a lot of booster money.
2) Bobby Bowden would of quit had they not thrown in this going away present for Jeff (loss of booster money)
3) Just a wild guess, but the moment Jeff Bowden resigned, boosters all over the country went to shangri la (in their minds) on a euphoric vacation ....leading to a large surge of booster money $.So there you have it. Financially speaking, Keeping bobby bowden coaching + getting rid of jeff ....has the potential to earn a lot more than 537k it cost us... And it may of been the best way to accomplish the mission of maximizing contributions..
*Shrug* Hell if I know.
GatorMatt said:
posted on November 17, 2006 11:54 AM — 130.218.254.81 — link — abuse?
I couldn't agree more. I've been trying to tell some people that, but I just don't think there will be a turnaround that quickly. I really am hoping that FSU gets a good O.C so the rivalry can go back to what it was. I really don't wanna see a crappy game next weekend
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 17, 2006 12:26 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Gatorpilot:
The even funnier thing about this "Bowden Way" that Joe keeps speaking of is the loyalty issue and how Bowden stated he is so loyal and committed to his personnel...
How he won't "sacrafice one guy" over the rest...
But yet, I seem to remember in 1984 the canning of Art Baker; who BB lured away from East Carolina; after one season that ended in a 7-3-2 record after his vaunted veer offense didn't take...
Again, I guess just another great example of the "Bowden Way"...
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 17, 2006 1:09 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Jon:
Here's a link to the Bowden contract...
www.tallahassee.com/assets/doc/CD501231115.DOC
It appears that this is a totally different agreement outside his current contract...
To me the more disturbing incident in this is the fact that Jeff would take this money for a job he:
A) Quit...
B) Performed horribly at...Just doesn't seem right...
I know anytime I come to Doak in the next six years, I will be boycotting the concession so I know my money has not contributed to this theivery and extortion of the university by the Bowdens...
I would suggest all Nole fans this situation has upset to do the same...
Joe said:
posted on November 17, 2006 2:23 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
With gator fans suggesting FSU fans should be angry with the payout is all I need to know that FSU did the right thing.
How any FSU fan could listen to any gator fan about what FSU fans should do is beyond my comprehension. Lest we forget the "University if "HELL YES WE CHEAT" has a sordid and sullied history unmatched in the state of Florida and ranks right up near the top in the nation in terms of corruption.
Glance at the 84' statement above by the NCAA. WOW!
Think the "footlocker" was grevious??? What about "TANK BLACK".???????? UF officials claimed they didn't know for almost 3 years despite MO COLLINS in the Fiesta bowl??? Double WOW!!
_____________________________________
While the payout might seem steep I would suggest it is a paltry sum and relieved FSU of a potential markteting disaster. I wonder how much $$$'s Bowden has generated for FSU both directly and indirectly.
Looked in that light it was a mere pittance and not even worth mentioning accept by silly gators with an agenda.
JB showed himself to be a good capitalist, and isn't that the American Way?What did SOS get in severance from the Redskins?
hmmmm?
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 17, 2006 4:40 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Ash:
No doubt, it was worth the money to get rid of what had just turned into a totally putrid attempt at something vaguley resembling an offensive scheme...
It's just a shame that because of the nepotism factor that it drug on so long and resulted in a state institution having to pay some clown for work not done when his work wasn't even that good...
As I posted earlier, obviously Art Baker wasn't afforded the same tolerance as Jeff was...
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 17, 2006 5:06 PM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Joe, I suggest you take a look around the net and the media...
There are alot of boosters and alumni that are very upset with this extortion of the school...
Wait lemme guess though...
"UF Probation, Tank Black, Blah, blah, blah..."
Keep squashin your grapes, Joe...
This situation with Jeff has been a fiasco from beginning to end...
Jon said:
posted on November 17, 2006 6:09 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
gatorhippy - Well after reading that contract... it's pretty clear that the payoff was a bribe to get him out quietly...instead of having fire him and getting the elder Bowden pissy... and having this turn into a pissing content on national tv, one in which ESPN would back Bowden 'the most winiest coach' and scrutinize the University...it would get ugly, with half the FSU fans behind Bowden and the other half against.... and then we still have his name on the field and his picture on the stained window at the stadium...
It is a very complex situation... I would never be able to judge it, without knowing all of the details. I have to hope that the boosters are acting in the best interest of the University...Whether we understand their actions, or not...
Ash said:
posted on November 18, 2006 4:21 AM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
Well it’s seems that one, two, or more Boosters put up the $537,500. The agreement says it came from non-donor revenue, which means they didn’t pull it from the scholarship funds. Again I’m sorry I don’t have an issue here, if it means we get what we want, Jeff gone, Bobby happy, and a brighter future, then as a Booster, I ask where can I contribute? Yes it’s an ugly end to an ugly situation, but lets not dwell on the now past, and instead look to the now future. GO NOLES.
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 18, 2006 10:02 AM — 72.40.35.247 — link — abuse?
Ash:
Actually the funds will be coming from sources such as concession sales...
I will agree though that at least the Noles got rid of him...
It's just too bad that it had to happen like it did...
My real issue isn't with that, it's about putting to bed this facade of "Bowden Way" that Joe holds so dearly on to...
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 18, 2006 10:04 AM — 72.40.35.247 — link — abuse?
Jon:
Yeah, my favorite section is the one where the boosters wrote in Jeff couldn't sue the Boosters, Inc or the school...
I also have to think that there was definitely a Bobby hand in this despite his denial of knowledge...
But that could just be the Gator in me...
LOL
Ash said:
posted on November 18, 2006 7:16 PM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
Gatorhippy,
The story will get out soon enough CokeCola paid the money, outright. The money was to go to the University, however it went to Jeff instead. It was a deal the AD and Booster's president worked out with them, to keep Bobby on.
Joe said:
posted on November 19, 2006 1:19 PM — 72.185.22.184 — link — abuse?
There are two sides of the fence...
The one that a couple of mouthy gators are on supported by some very naive Nole fans
or
the side that supports Bobby Bowden and what he has meant to FSU.
Being an FSU fan which side do I want to be on??
Wow! that is a tough one!! Later boys!!gatorhippy said:
posted on November 20, 2006 10:42 AM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse?
Joe:
Once again spoken like a true FAN that enjoys FSU football and Bowden rather than a booster/student/alum with personal interest and ties to the institution as a whole...
You speak as though FSU would not even exist if not for Bowden...
You can talk about what Bowden has meant to FSU, but FSU gave the man a job and provided him with the facilities to attract and develop his recruits and the capital to higher top notch (or family members)coaches...
Would Bowden been able to acheive this at, say West Virginia?
Doubtful...
Sorry, but Bowden isn't bigger than the very place that gave him his stage...
To think so echoes the very arrogance that Bowden has displayed as of late...
Joe said:
posted on November 21, 2006 5:20 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
Ash,
I believe enough disclosure has been given.
What more do you need? Where does this entitlement come from??? You really must hate Bowden and FSU. How absolutely conflicted!!
Oh and lest you get all warm and fuzzy with comments by such truthful?? gator fans that are 100% in agreement with you.
Are you aware of the following??:
Gerald Owens?Hassan Jones?
the TGRRT?
Careful with trusting such fans helpful?? suggestions... JMHO
Jon said:
posted on November 22, 2006 4:48 AM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
Joe - we know how relevant your opinion is... You have spent the last 2-years telling us how great Jeff Bowden was....and how he would never lose his job.
You have been the equivalent of a parrot sitting on these message boards.... roaaaaaaa "entitlement" ... roaaaa "fair-weather"..... roaaaa "bowden way"
I got news for you... I wish we had fans who cared as much as gator fans do about their football team. I wish FSU fans were that devoted... I wish we had fans that realized that the future cannot be sacrificed because of past allegiance/tradition. I wish we would of fired Jeff Bowden just as fast as they fired Ron Zook... God knows we wouldn't be sitting with a .500 season right now....
And guess what Joe? My wish will come true...
The following generations of fans (who are internet savvy) are going to have instant access to tons of information... And we are not going to tolerate the destruction of things we love... So yes, I am entitled biotch..but...you better learn to love it, because your time (worshiping the past) is quickly coming to the end.
Ash said:
posted on November 22, 2006 5:57 AM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
Joe,
You are delusional, having full disclosure has nothing to do with or about gator fans. You act like that’s what’s been driving this train. Wake up, the real world is calling. Jeff Bowden sucked as an offensive coordinator, and was highly compensated for sucking. There is no way to hide these truths. In the six years he was OC the offensive steadily declined, in every major category. But in your delusional world if we just waited two or three more years he would have brought it around. AND JUST SO WE UNDERSTAND ONE ANOTHER, ONCE AND FOR ALL, THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH BOBBY BOWDEN, so get off that horse it don’t want to ride no more. If you did as bad job in your work as Jeff did you wouldn’t have lasted a year, a month, a week and you sure as hell wouldn’t have been highly compensated for doing a BAD job.
The $537,500, Jeff is to receive was intended for the general scholarship fund , so now many deserving none athletic kids may not receive a scholarship this year, (some may not even be able to go to FSU now) while Jeff sits for the next five and a half years as an “independent contractor” for the University. JOE WAKE UP KIDS WILL SUFFER BECAUSE A MAN WHO WAS BAD AT HIS JOB WILL GET PAID UNDER THE TABLE, JUST SO HIS FATHER WONT LEAVE.
I don’t listen to Gator fans, very often, there opinion means nothing to me when it comes to Florida State Football. But if I have to choose between a Gator fan who is making sense or a delusional FSU fan who thinks its all a great conspiracy to get rid of Bobby Bowden, I’ll take the Gator fan, sorry.
Cane_Nation said:
posted on November 22, 2006 10:53 AM — 205.166.218.39 — link — abuse?
I hate to break it to all of you, but the problem at FSU are much bigger than Jeff, although that is a good place to start. How about the strength and conditioning coach? Mickey Andrews gets really conservative on defense against the likes of NC State and Maryland, but will blitz the hell out of Miami. I know we suck worse than you right now, but if you'll blitz a team with equal athletes then why not one with lesser atheletes. These two schools still have better atheletes than 95% of their opponents, the problem is that we are not developing the skill players at all. The quarterbacks, running backs, and recievers are not improving with age. The gap in talent isn't what it used to be. While a Maryland still don't match up athelete for athelete with either of us, the gap has shrunk enough that better coaching will more than make up the gap. And that is what we're seeing right now. So be happy that Jeff is gone but don't think the work is over quite yet.
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 22, 2006 1:24 PM — 72.40.35.247 — link — abuse?
Ash & Jon:
Joe's Bobby "fetish" is beyond reproach...
I'm glad for the Noles that you all were FINALLY able to get Jeff out of there...
Unfortunately at the expense of a large chunk of athletics money of which he did not deserve...
I've been looking for info on who some of the other likely coaches that will be leaving as well..
Any info on that?
I would assume some of the offensive position coaches would be on the way out as well...
Joe said:
posted on November 22, 2006 2:46 PM — 65.35.217.174 — link — abuse?
For the record:
I have never been a advocate or vocal critic of JB. Never have stated whether he would leave or stay. I just knew it wouldn't be any fans decision. Seems I was exactly right!! LOLI never feel that there is a single scapegoat for anything in football.
I just feel as a fan there is a right and wrong way to do things. Whining and crying about things you have no control over seems delusional to me.JMO
I know this is hard for some of you to grasp but it is only a GAME!! Unlike Jon and Ash I don't wrap my self- worth on whether FSU wins or loses.
If that is being delusional so be it. I call it reality.
Sure I am unhappy when FSU loses, and happy when they win but thats where it ends.Not that it matters and not that I give JB credit but FSU despite its won/loss record Every major category did not decline.
FSU led the ACC in Passing last season and is close this season. They had their 4th best rushing totals in history in JB first year calling plays. Just a few facts.
JMHO but how the quality of the players and how they execute and avoid mistakes has more to do with winning than anything else in CFB. Think if FSU had Phillip Rivers rather than Chris Rix the results would have been different? Who recruited Rix? Wasn't it Mark Richt?
If I am a booster and I decide to give JB a going away present$$ I am not allowed to? Ash
Wow! Are you some kind of communist or welfare junkie?
If I was such a booster, I definately wouldn't endow a scholarship to either of you two jerks.
You are an embarrassment to FSU with your severe entitlement issues.Bowden isn't perfect but you two and your value system can't hold a candle to what he has stood for at FSU.
I admire very few, but I admire Bobby and his values, and what he means to FSU. I can guarantee he wouldn't display the classlessness and lack of decency you two numbskulls have shown in these threads.
As to gator hippy's remark about "Fetish" lets leave his sexual attitudes out of this discussion, I am not interested and have no desire to participate in his own personal "Crying Game". That I am afraid is his own problem.Perhaps he needs to run to some message board that will better cater to his apparent deviant life style of choice. lol
Oh and feigning interest in FSU coaches leaving or staying is a nice touch.... Try being less transparent the next time. Must be a member of the old TGRRT. Now that is a Tally organization that all gator fans must be proud???
Luke said:
posted on November 22, 2006 8:56 PM — 67.35.110.26 — link — abuse?
I know Bobby was once a great coach. I just want to know why everyone blames jeff for the teams problems, I mean yes he is incompetent. But Bobby is the one that hired him so it's really his fault in hiring an incompetent offensive coordinator. Why do you think the good assistant coaches leave for other teams? Because Bobby promotes his incompetent son instead of more deserving and experienced assisstant coaches. From an outsider's view, FSU's football program is corrupt and it will not become efficient and good again until the corruption is stopped (starting with Bobby.)
Hell, he's an old guy and he wants to help out his friends and his sons, at least he knows how the world works. It's too bad FSU football has to pay the price.
Ash said:
posted on November 24, 2006 12:55 PM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
Joe,
There’s an old saying that goes, “never try and teach a pig to sing, it waist your time and annoys the pig.” That’s how I feel when any of us discuss this issue with you, so I’m going to stop wasting my time with you and walk away from this conversation.
And just for the record I am an FSU booster and season ticket holder, who’s money by the way went to the general scholarship program and not to one man’s pocket, so hopefully some kid will be able to do what I haven’t so far in life, and attend FSU next year thanks to me. One last point I didn’t become a booster because of one man, or one team, but for the University I have come to love and support. So I support all FSU teams, no matter how this plays out, no matter who is what coach next year I will, like those players on the court, field or diamond am a Seminole.
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 24, 2006 6:15 PM — 70.121.108.178 — link — abuse?
Bwahahahahahaha....
Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe...
Where should I start...
First:
You thought I was referring to myself with the Fetish comment and that it was in a sexual conotation...TOOOOOO FUNNNNY!!!!!
Secondly:
"Fetish" in general refers to any unquestioning loyalty and devotion of objects or figures...So as you can see this would and is a perfect description of your feelings regarding Bobby Bowden...
Third:
That you would put Bowden and sexual feelings together perhaps tells us all (albeit somewhat disturbingly) perhaps where YOUR feelings for the Bowdens actually lie...Your unflittering respect and devotion reminds me of the song "Opiate" by TOOL...
Look up the lyrics...I think you'll recognize some of your feelings and be able to relate...
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 24, 2006 6:24 PM — 70.121.108.178 — link — abuse?
Ash & Jon:
Joe's irrational suspiscion and fears aside...
Have either of you heard any rumor or whispers of a possible canidate list for the OC position?
Also, I happened across this in the Orlando Sentinel this morning...
"Bowden wants son to coach in bowl..."
What do you fellas think of this?
Seems like Bobby is continuing to stoke the flames of the booster fire...
Ash said:
posted on November 24, 2006 7:05 PM — 71.52.20.71 — link — abuse?
Kevin gave the canidates at the begining of this stream. Chris Hatcher is still #1 on everyones list, I don't think thats going to change. It also sounds like he will be bringing most of his own staff with him. Jeff can't coach at the Bowl Game the agreement goes into affect November 26, 2006. I think thats just a rumor, however if they can't get anyone by the Bowl then they may let him stay through the Bowl Game.
gatorhippy said:
posted on November 24, 2006 7:29 PM — 70.121.108.178 — link — abuse?
Ash:
Yeah, I saw that but was wondering if there was any newer info on that...
I would think with the UM job opening up, Jimbo and Fedora might be a stretch...
Hatcher seems like a natural fit with the current staff and the obvious aquaintances he has there already...
I just wonder how well B. Bowden accepts the guy replacing Jeff, especially if things don't pick up next year with the change...
Good luck Saturday, freaking Noles scare me to death going into this one...
Jon said:
posted on November 24, 2006 9:59 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
gatorhippy - To be honest with you.. after finding out all the details behind Jeff Bowden leaving..Knowing his dad spent his entire career claiming the game was "about more than money".. Knowing that he (Bobby Bowden) played an ultimatum card causing us to have to keep his son longer.. Knowing that Bobby Bowden will not keep his word and step down, even though the University did force his hand (regardless of the semantics)..
To be honest with you, I am having a hard time staying interested in FSU news. I'm going to need an off-season to clear my head and purge myself with the negative feelings I harbor right now...
So.. I don't care who they put as offensive coordinator, as long as they are willing to learn. I think they could of placed me as offensive coordinator (having no coaching experience) and I would of been more successful than Jeff Bowden. As long as we hire someone where ego is not an issue, we should be fine... Someone who watches Belichick, Spurrier, Parcells, Petrino and Shanahan.. and uses these amazing existing offenses as a building block for their own sculpture. The game has grew more complex and if Bobby Bowden is right about the "parity" he always uses as an excuse, we are going to need an offensive coordinator who is one hell of a coach. Someone who can handle the dynamics of shifting game-plans in the middle of the game, instead of "staying the course" (during a game) and adjusting during the week (when you have already lost).
Renegae06 said:
posted on November 26, 2006 4:20 PM — 216.220.208.238 — link — abuse?
Cane_Nation...
You could'nt be more right when referring to Mickey Andrews. I've been saying the same thing to my self that past few years. Though he is a great defensive cordinator and one of the greatest defensive minds in college football his scheming and conservativeness is sometimes a cause for concern. I see us play Miami every year and total up several sacks because he blitz's the hell out of you guys. But when we play the teams you mentioned as well as Clemson this year he won't blitz. Why is that? I Don't mind because we always have one of the better defenses in the kountry and our defense keeps us from goin 4-8 instead of 8-4 most of the time. Statisticly we are ranked among the top 15 or so every year. But like you said that as well as the strength and conditioning must improve. And most importantly the offensive lines caoch and QB coach (Darryl Dickey). But that is a valid point you made, one that I noticed my self.Jon said:
posted on November 26, 2006 10:47 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
His defense reminds me of the Denver broncos zone coverage....It fails badly vs. decent passing teams, allowing far too many 3rd and longs...
However.. he mans up a lot more when his team is not destroyed by injuries...and the zone defense is by far the best way to minimize the bleeding..so IMHO, he is calling exactly what he should be calling...
And with that said.. we have got to start using more scholarships on the secondary.. Not calling anyone out *cough Carter*, but our secondary is weak on one side... just like it has been for what seems like forever (Sanders days)
Joe said:
posted on November 27, 2006 3:23 PM — 65.32.106.22 — link — abuse?
How refreshing to find Jon is no longer interested in FSU news. That is the best Christmas present yet!! Glad to see you are finally seeing the light. Jon....
As to Ash and his professed self-importance as a FSU booster????......
I remain far more impressed with Bowden as far as what he has meant to FSU.
Sorry, Ash but giving some inflated SAT and GPA student today a free scholly doesn't impress me that much. Good intentions aside, I have found little to be impressed by when it comes to higher education in the state of Florida. Perhaps you can enlighten me?
--------------------------------------------
I do hear they have excellent degrees in "NEGATIVOLOGY"(LOL), and obviously Jon and Ash are working on their PHds... Good luck! and if it makes you happy? Who am I to turn you away??
As for me I just Cheer win or lose. I love it when FSU wins and certainly am not happy when they lose, but it still is only a game to me. That it is more than that to some is a bit troubling.See: USC fan killing the Clemson fan!! CHILLING!!
I realize that Jon and Ash claim they know all
the answers and somehow think they can initiate change by their whining and crying???
Just me but I found out a long time ago of what I can and can't change. Bowden and FSU will make the decisions regardless of fans wishes.
I take great comfort knowing that!!Joe said:
posted on November 28, 2006 2:17 PM — 72.186.246.28 — link — abuse?
Well, gator hippy it has been my experience when someone has given about 25 years of their life to a program, that giving a little financial reward is the right thing to do.
Now if those boosters involved were reluctant to do such a thing I could understand some silly gator fan's assertion.Clearly, that wasn't the case.
Of course being a gator fan.. You wouldn't understand!!I must admit though I am rather puzzled why a gator fan would care so much about this???
Care to explain?
Just a theory, but could it be you are "tooling" Ash and Jon, and they are just too naive to realize it?Unlike them, I learned many years ago... NEVER TRUST A GATOR FAN!!
Jon said:
posted on November 28, 2006 11:26 PM — 69.246.161.119 — link — abuse?
Joe - you have never contributed anything relevant to this board. Not one person on here gives a damn about anything you have to say. I respect the opinion of every single person on here, with you being the only exception....and I guarantee you I am not the only one. You have managed to make a complete jackass out of yourself in every thread you have graced. The only person who believes the bullshit you type = yourself.
Do us all a favor and don't respond to this.
Go troll somewhere else.
MB007 said:
posted on November 14, 2006 9:31 PM — 70.147.122.236 — link — abuse?Yes! There's hope!