October 21, 2007
For Sale sign up at Bowden's home
Following the Noles nightmare 29-37 loss to rival Miami, Bobby Bowden awoke on Sunday morning to an unfamiliar sight - a "For Sale" sign in his front yard.
A disgruntled FSU fan left the sign as a message for the coach overnight on Saturday.
Bowden saw the large red sign by the road when he left his Killearn Estates home around 7:30 a.m. He removed it and laid it on the side of his driveway."I'll save it for when I get ready to move," he said. "It'll save me a few bucks."
Bowden laughed off the incident, saying he's used to the scrutiny that comes with losing, although he hasn't had the "For Sale" sign prank in quite a while.
"Probably back in the early '80s, something like that, probably around '83," he said. "It's kind of like, 'Here we go again.'"
Bowden had worse when he coached at West Virginia, although he said he removed "For Sale" signs there, too. In 1974, students hung a likeness of Bowden in effigy from a tree.
Despite the loss, Bowden says that he isn't giving up on this season just yet, even though FSU would need to sweep its remaining conference games to have a chance to play for the ACC title.
“You don’t want to kiss away the year,” Bowden said. “I still want to save this year if we can.”
In watching Bowden's presser, you can tell that the veteran coach is worried about his team's performance, even if he is still putting on a brave face. He's gone from saying this team is one player away to saying that the Seminoles are one recruiting class away from contending on a national level.
From where I stand, I'm going to disagree with Coach Bowden. Maybe it is time to throw in the towel and start playing for 2008.
Comments:
1st_and_NOLE
posted on October 21, 2007 10:24 PM — 71.14.108.232 — link — abuse?
said:
In regards to how this season is going... I'll comment on that later.
In regards to the incident regarding the sign in Bowden's yard... I'll speak my mind freely when I say...
If I saw a "fan" disrespect the Bowden family by attempting to put a for sale sign in his yard... to be frank, I'd beat their ass.
Bobby Bowden has done great and amazing things for Florida State. He deserves much better then to be disrespected and slapped in the face by some classless piece of crap that's never accomplished in their pathetic life what Bowden's done in a year.
Bobby Bowden has done more then build up the football program. You could easily argue he built up the entire university. The university has grown exponentially in size since Bowden's arrival - at a much faster rate then pre-Bowden. Also, since Bowden has been there FSU has opened a new medical school and has made great strives in improving many programs. A lot of the growth has to do with FSU football putting the entire university on the national map.
Bowden has done countless great things on and off the field. Probably more then a coward with a for sale sign has ever done.
Lennie Collins
posted on October 21, 2007 10:28 PM — 70.251.186.200 — link — abuse? said:
I like Robert's Bowden attitude to just shake that junk off. I actually thought this would be a "turn around" year for Florida State. I picked them to win the ACC. I'd say to Coach Bowden if I were the AD comeback for the 2008 season if you can't get us to a National Title could you step down. I would ask him to stay on in some aspect and name the stadium/playing field after him.
Big Tide said:
posted on October 21, 2007 10:50 PM — 12.208.88.211 — link — abuse?
I totally agree with 1st and Nole regarding Bobby Bowden's impact on Florida State University. Everyone will agree that putting the sign in the yard was in poor taste, BUT let's face it guys - ol' Bobby B. just ain't the coach he used to be. It is just sad that Bowden and Paterno won't be remembered as the great coaches they once were, but for old men that did not know their time had passed. BTW, Lennie, they have already named the field after him - Bobby Bowden Field at Doak Campbell Stadium.
Lennie Collins
posted on October 21, 2007 10:59 PM — 70.251.186.200 — link — abuse? said:
Big Tide(Comment #4) that goes to show you that I really don't follow Florida State. I used to play attention to them in the late 90's because my ex-wife cousin, Derrick Alexander, used to play for them. I should have known this, man. Ol' Coach Bowden PUT Florida State on the map. I agree with you that Coach Bowden and Coach Paterno should step down. I can see Ol' JoPa going Woody Hayes on players & fans. I believe Coach Bowden will step down. Coach Paterno will be forced out!
Big Tide said:
posted on October 22, 2007 7:40 AM — 12.208.88.211 — link — abuse?
Lennie, it's impossible to keep up with all these teams, etc. But your comment brings up a good point that my Dad and I discuss quite often. How smart is it to start naming stadiums or football fields after someone who is still coaching. Not only is the field named after Coach Bowden, but they have this big statue of him outside the stadium. To those real close to FSU it doesn't seem that strange, but I think you were correct to assume that the powers that be at FSU would begin erecting statues or naming the field after Coach Bowden AFTER he retired.
Lennie Collins
posted on October 22, 2007 11:14 AM — 70.251.186.200 — link — abuse? said:
Hey Big Tide(Comment #7) to sum it up...I don't care how good the coach was in the past. Like Janet Jackson song in 1986, What Have You Done For Me Lately. I am an Oklahoma Sooners fan and I once heard Robert Stoops say that if Oklahoma is not playing for or at least attempting to play for a National Title he knows the fans will get restless and call for his job. He is right! I admit the way this fan went about it is cowardly no doubt about it. Some coaches know when to step away and some don't. I hope that Joseph Paterno does not go out like Woody Hayes. I believe that Robert Bowden will step down on his own and Joe Paterno won't. I believe FSU did all this, the statue and field, to hint to Bobby Bowden hey we love you and thank you for what you have done so can you know step down. So you are right that is stange to do it while he still is actively coaching.
1st_and_NOLE
posted on October 22, 2007 11:25 AM — 71.14.108.232 — link — abuse? said:
Actually, we have a lot to cling too. The future is still extremely bright. The incoming recruiting class could easily be top 5. The new coaches are getting their type of players coming in and they appear to be some of the best.
It's ok Gator fans are getting in as many cheap shots as they can. It's still so funny how much Gator fans enjoy calling it Zook field. Must be due to the pain of the long losing drought in Tallahassee that they endured. Hey, at least you've been successful recently in Tally.
It's ok... take your shots now because Florida State won't be down too much longer. The team is improved over last year and will continue to make progress as the season goes on.
We won't be down long so enjoy it while it lasts.
FSU Derek said:
posted on October 22, 2007 12:23 PM — 192.107.44.37 — link — abuse?
Bobby can step down when he wants. He's earned it. He doesn't do much coaching, he lets the other guys do that, and we have a lot of good coaches. Bobby delegates, and it doesn't hurt recruiting when kids know they can play for the winniest coach ever in college football.
FSU Derek said:
posted on October 22, 2007 12:25 PM — 192.107.44.37 — link — abuse?
Bobby can step down when he wants. He's earned it. He doesn't do much coaching and he doesn't have to, he lets the other guys do that, and we have a lot of good coaches. Bobby delegates, and it doesn't hurt recruiting when kids know they can play for the winniest coach ever in college football.
Lennie Collins
posted on October 22, 2007 1:02 PM — 70.251.186.200 — link — abuse? said:
How long are Florida State fans really going to put up with losing to Miami and Florida? I know it is the right thing to say for now but let's see 3 to 5 years in the future, if they keep losing to their biggest rivals. I am not questioning what he has done in the past and really it is a question for Florida State fans to asked themselves. Bobby Bowden has to be mentioned in the conversation of "best" coaches of all time, no ifs, ands, or buts about it!
gatorhippy
posted on October 22, 2007 1:50 PM — 70.121.185.56 — link — abuse? said:
1st & Nole (12):
First...
One would LOOK to the future and CLING to the past...
Second...
You obviously haven't been watching the same Noles I have this season...
I've seen nothing but the same as we've all watched since 1999...
A slow winding death spiral of a once proud program that is a severely hollow shell of it's former self due to the egotism of a once great coach that has been practically deitized in a manner bordering idolatry...
Personally, Ron Zook Field is simply so sweet sounding because of the fact that it came on a night when FSU admin was foolish enough to dedicate the field to its ACTIVE coach against its BIGGEST rival...
Kinda like breaking out the "Conquered" unis for the Duke game this weekend...
Talk about setting up for a run down the conveyor and into the buzzsaw...
Yikes...
jensteve said:
posted on October 22, 2007 2:25 PM — 71.100.237.209 — link — abuse?
My dad retired and was bored stiff. Went back to his company and they found him part time support work. His knowledge and contacts were invaluable to the company, but they were able to move in someone else that was talented.
Also, every Sunday, a Preacher gets up and preaches from the pulpit, and that Preacher KNOWS the 100-year old lady in the front row knows just as much about the Bible as he does, she just doesn't have the job of Preacher.
What do those two mean? 1) It's time for Bobby to go; 2) Someone who blogs should not be dismissed by the administration as not knowing what we are talking about!
We aren't talking about losing to Florida by 10 when they are ranked 3rd and we are 5th, or a conference upset to Virginia, in a night game, while still finishing 10-2 and top 5.
We are talking about Wake and Clemson, and a DOWN Miami team at home. It's a JOKE! I have beena fan since 1976, listening on the radio before the advent of mass Satellite coverage. I have the scrapbooks as a kid, hundreds of thousands of dollars in tickets, apparel, my tax dollars for scholarships, you name it! Bottom line, we are getting out recruited by everyone else because they are telling kids FSU is done and Bobby is leaving. We are getting out-coached and our players are not prepared. The training is awful, the recruiting is awful, and the play calling is awful.
My Dad didn't want to retire either, but sometimes you need to do the right thing.
I am beginning to NOT blame Jeff Bowdne, I am blaming the recruiting process. The players are simply not good enough.
No excuse, we didn't have the best players in Lincoln in 1980 or against dan marino and No. 1 Pitt either, but COACHING and PLAY CALLING led to 18-14 and 36-22.
Someone do something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Regan said:
posted on October 22, 2007 4:00 PM — 205.188.116.136 — link — abuse?
Pathetic. No matter what coach, no matter what team.
I guarantee that Bobby Bowden has done more for FSU than the (insert your own word) that put up the sign.
My question: who is a better choice to coach at FSU right now?
Sorry...guess that was overkill :-)
Ramblin' Gator said:
posted on October 22, 2007 4:04 PM — 67.97.209.36 — link — abuse?
#18: Hey Lennie,
I would like to think that Bowden would have enough class to not hang on through multiple losing seasons, so my image of his "own terms" would be to leave after a signature bowl win following a good season. That being said, before the Adrian McPherson fiasco, I didn't think Bobby had much class. Since then, he seems to be a bit more responsible than putting felons on the field and explaining it with "aw shucks" and aplomb.
IMHO, they should stick with XLee. Weatherford makes fewer mistake, but he also brings a lot less options to the game plan.
posted on October 22, 2007 4:30 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?War Eagle Atlanta
said:
Bowden would have liked to have hung up his spikes with dignity already, but that geezer JoPa keeps getting wheeled up to the sideline and Bobby can't risk having him take the record.
I've said it before. This doesn't end until one of them dies.
jensteve said:
posted on October 22, 2007 4:38 PM — 71.100.237.209 — link — abuse?
And that is the whole point, isn't it? It is selfishness that keeps it going, wanting that record, as if the 15 straight Top 5's (unmatched), heisman's, Coach of the Year, national titles, more pro players with the exception of Miami - as if that is not enough.
If he can't keep the record in the ACC against Joe who is in the Big 10, then it don't look good.
He should step down at the end of this season because by his own measure he is not getting it done.
1st_and_NOLE
posted on October 22, 2007 5:15 PM — 71.14.108.232 — link — abuse? said:
I think this season is going as expected (for me).
I'm not sure what most FSU fans (or other fans) were expecting this year but it probably wasn't realistic.
The new coaches came into a tough situation, plain and simple.
The team and players haven't been coached well for many years. Beyond coaching, they were allowed to become lazy and out of shape.
What's the first thing we heard and read about when they new coaches were hired? How out of shape the players were by the new coaches standards.
It's not like the new coaches simply had to fix some mechanical issues and implement their new system... they seriously had to lay even the most basic of foundations - conditioning. They've had to rebuild the team from the ground up from conditioning, to how they practice, technique, fundamentals, and everything else under the sun.
It was a much bigger job then most realized.
Also, the coaches may not have exactly all the types of players they need. For example, Trickett's OL starts many freshmen despite there being plenty of upper classmen on the depth chart. Why is that? Because the freshmen are more of the type of OL Trickett wants - not the guys he inherited. Also, FSU has done a poor job recruiting OL the past several years so also the young guys may just be flat better.
Am I the only one that can tell the offense is improving!? It shouldn't be that hard to see. Consider this, FSU's offensive rankings are about where they were last year. Now, simply by saying that it may not seem like the offense has improved at all. However, there's more to it then simply the numbers. Look at the schedules. Last year FSU played one of the weakest schedules they've played in DECADES yet the offense was miserable and they finished a pathetic 7-6. This years schedule was ranked the #3, 2, & 2 toughest in the country by Rivals, SI, and ESPN respectively. So, while the improvements may not reflect in the team's overall record at the end of the year or the offensive #'s... it's clear due to the much tougher competition and road games that the team has improved. Lets face it, if FSU played last years schedule this year they could be in the NC hunt.
Also, consider this... despite the loss FSU's offense moved the ball at will. Granted, turnovers are a problem right now, but FSU can move the ball. How many times did they punt against Miami? Twice maybe at the most? The entire game FSU either scored or turned the ball over. I don't remember a single 3 and out by the Noles. Now, turnovers were a HUGE problem but some of those were kinda fluky and all of them were correctable.
The recruiting class this staff is assembling will be one of the best in the nation. They are pulling in quality players that the staff will be able to mold from the moment they step on campus and not have to fix.
IF (it is a big if) Florida State goes 7-6 again with this schedule it's a considerable improvement over 7-6 with last years schedule and the Noles will only continue to improve going into 2008.
Again, most people probably had unrealistic expectations for the Noles this year given the severe problems the team had and the daunting schedule but the future is bright and that's worth mentioning.
TampaGator said:
posted on October 22, 2007 5:20 PM — 71.101.63.118 — link — abuse?
Jensteve:
Talk about selfish.
Coach Bowden built FSU's FB program almost from the ground up, made it one of the best in the country, gave you some of the fondest sports memories of your life...
...and you'd just have him taken out back and shot (figuratively speaking)--because YOU aren't satisfied with the results of the last few years.
You're simply spoiled--and you want to bite the hand that spoiled you (...but Bobby Bowden is selfish).You put that sign up in Bowden's yard, dincha', and now you're try'n to justify it anonomously, right?
Even a Gator will acknowledge it--Coach Bowden deserves better.
GO GATORS!!
Lennie Collins
posted on October 22, 2007 5:34 PM — 70.251.186.200 — link — abuse? said:
The comment Bobby Bowden deserves better and deserves to go out on his own terms keeps coming up. Remember a fan did this not administration. If Florida State fans and others are this defensive over a fan I can't wait to see the comments when the A.D. starts applying pressure. Hey I enjoy Bobby Bowden but hey if the majority of Florida State fans are happy with the current state of the football program hey who am I to say whether he should stay or go. If Bobby Bowden loves Florida State as much as Florida State loves him THEN I am sure he will step down if he no longer feels he is doing a good job. The ones buying season tickets really are the ones should be talking. I can only speak for myself. If I was paying that much for Sooners' season tickets and Roberts Stoops were turning out sub/under par seasons I would get tired of hearing "next year" I want results now!
gatorhippy
posted on October 22, 2007 6:17 PM — 70.121.185.56 — link — abuse? said:
Lennie (#28):
We've already seen that situation...
FSU AD Dave Hart applied pressure in the Jeff debacle and "buyout"...
Which resulted in FSU Prez TK Wetherell informing Hart over the summer that his contract would not be renewed...
Lennie Collins
posted on October 22, 2007 6:40 PM — 70.251.186.200 — link — abuse? said:
Hey Gatorhippy (Comment #28)...I am going to say this. I just want to see how long Florida State Fans are really gone stand by losing to Clemson, Wake Forest, Miami, & Florida before they say "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!" I say 3 years and these same fans will say: Bobby yous gots ta go!
Zac said:
posted on October 22, 2007 7:39 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
I agree with the "...fans get spoiled..." I can remember WVU football pre-Bowden & post-Bowden. With the exception of that one bad year Bobby had, neither pre nor post were pretty until Don Nehlan came along. Even then, his proverbial Rome wasn't built in a day.
It's a shame how a man can give his all, build a program from scratch, win some championships, then have some lean years, and it opens up for debate as to whether or not he should be ousted. It's ridiculous. I said so as much when people called for Joe Pa's job when his team went 4-7 in 2004. Since loosing to Northwestern that year, his Lions have gone 28-7.
Bowden didn't have a loosing season in 2004, nor has he had one since. It only took him 2 years to act when things began going south. Yes, my expectations were perhaps unreasonable, given the coaching changes, but one still has to give it a chance to work. I think this whole anti-Bowden thing is not only premature, it's unfair. Just a thought.
Big Tide said:
posted on October 22, 2007 8:18 PM — 12.208.88.211 — link — abuse?
Jensteve #19 and 1st and Nole #26 are both excellent post. I remember back when Coach Bowden was playing anybody and everybody just to build up the program and yes he has meant much more to FSU than just wins and losses, but Jensteve is right!! Back in the day, Bobby Bowden would out coach you. He would gamble, mix it up, get ALL he could out of what he had. That magic just doesn't seem to be there anymore. It isn't something that you can put into stats - how many first downs did we make, how many yards rushing, passing, etc. But you can see it in the won/loss column at the end of the year.
One thing to remember, college football is a business, not a fraternity or a family reunion. Bowden is paid a lot of money to put a product on the field every Saturday. The question you have to ask is whether another coach, under the same circumstances, with the same record, would be treated the same way. I think everyone would agree that it was time for a change.
Finally, people seem to forget that Bowden is over 70 years old. This isn't a man that did great things for the university and is being run off while he's still able to coach. I think Bowden's age is his primary problem. I don't care if it's horseshoes, pool, poker, football coaching or running a hardware store - there is no 70 year old man that can keep up with or out think a man with talent and experience that is 20 or 30 years his junior. Look at these old geezers in congress that stay forever and stand around trying to speak with their hands shaking and drool all over their faces (Sen. Byrd from West VA comes to mind). People keep pouring money into these old fools' campaigns because they have access and connections that they very well might lose if there was a changing of the guard. Don't think for a moment that the same isn't true in college football. The powerful and wealthy boosters that are tight with Bobby want him around because of the access they are afforded to the program. A new coach would mean all bets are off! A whole new deal. Believe me that is precisely what happened at Alabama. Mike Dubose got the job because he was a long time assistant and he was part of that "inner circle." Bama finally had to throw in the towel on that kind of thinking and go out and get the best coach for the job. That same thing is going to happen at FSU. Will it be next year? Two years? Five years? That is really the only real question.....
T-Mac
posted on October 22, 2007 8:34 PM — 66.78.139.117 — link — abuse? said:
This might sound crazy to some folks, but T-Mac really thinks Mike Shula deserves another shot at Coaching at the college level.
He did leave Tuscaloosa with a winning record.
What Shula needs to do is be way more aggressive in his style and the play-calling.
Shula could potentially Coach for the next 40 years.
In Joe Pa's case, 50 years.
Mike looks just like his Dad.
Mike just needs that piss & vinegar in Coaching style like Don had.
It just seemed that Shula tried to be a people-pleaser while in Tuscaloosa.
Saban couldn't care less.
Saban is the type that if you don't like him, he'd simply say fugk you!!!
T-Mac hopes that Mike Shula is given a chance somewhere.
With the right staff in place, he could be very successful.
Alabama was his first Coaching gig and he had a winning record.
People need to recognize that.
T-Mac just droppin a few thoughts.
*T-Mac approved this message.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on October 22, 2007 9:07 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
The game has passed Bowden by. His confusion is evident in his post-game press conferences. He is a spectator who won't relinquish his grip on the program he once made great.
It's not really funny anymore, just sad. But I don't think Bowden's going anywhere.
jensteve said:
posted on October 22, 2007 9:30 PM — 71.100.237.209 — link — abuse?
Selfish? Are you kidding? the state has an interest in fielding a competitive football team. We are not. We have not been for some time.
Perhaps that is okay elsewhere, but not here. I was listening to Bobby on an old school radio with batteries I would sneak out of a flashlight late at night because I was supposed to be asleep. I am like many otehrs who can claim we have been there from the beginning. I can accept 7-4-1 and beating Indiana in the All American Bowl because the team was competitive. I can take 7-5, 1983 pre-season #6 with Kelly Lowery at QB, but then losing to Tulane 34-28. Why, the players and staff were competitive. What we are watching right now is abysmal, and those fans and players deserve better from the University.
T-Mac
posted on October 22, 2007 10:19 PM — 66.78.139.117 — link — abuse? said:
Agreed, there just really comes a time where you have to walk away.
Walk away with that head held high.
Bowden and Paterno are 2 of the greatest.
We all know that.
Lets be realistic here.
Are they gonna Coach when they are 90 yrs old?
Gene Stallings put it well once.
He said, (I don't wanna be on the sideline in a wheelchair)!!!
Stallings could be Coaching anywhere in the country right now if he so chose.
He knew when to walk away.
There is life after football.
Football is a great sport/living.
There is more to life though.
FSU will still be there when Bowden is gone.
Hell, Bama is still there even though Mike Dubose is gone.
That was a joke by T-Mac.
*T-Mac approved this message.
1GatorMatt
posted on October 23, 2007 1:02 AM — 70.171.18.91 — link — abuse? said:
This is a double edged sword for Florida fans. On one hand, if he stays around, Florida is almost guaranteed a victory. On the other hand, since the computers do factor in strength of schedule, FSU tends to hurt that strength when it is needed at the end of the year. Quite frankly, I think he's embarassing himself. Take the Ron Zook example (granted, he hasn't been around for 30 or so years, but the concept is the same): Florida was at the top if it's game in the nineties and early into the 21st century. Ron Zook came in, screwed things up, and the program was in dissaray. They brought in new blood, and in two years, look what happened? I'm sure FSU has the talent in place right now, but they don't utilize it. I still think that Jeff and his assistants are playing old school football (much like the Big 10), and looks whats happening? Like another post said, this is a business, not a charity. Force him to resign so the rivalry can become what it once was again
T-Mac
posted on October 23, 2007 1:29 AM — 66.78.139.117 — link — abuse? said:
Gatorpilot, thoughts on Ole Miss?
Where does T-Mac start???
This is a team LOADED with talent.
17 starters returned.
Almost beat Florida.
Almost beat Alabama.
Almost doesn't COUNT!!!
Got beatdown by the Hogs!
44-8.
There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for giving up 44 points to anybody.
T-Mac doesn't care who it is.
The talent is alway's there.
Year in and year out!
Not sure which way to go on Coach O.
T-Mac thinks he needs another year.
T-Mac could write a book Gatorpilot.
The Grove is off the chain!!!
Ole Miss fans are the best bro!
T-Mac sends a shoutout to Patrick Willis!!!
Whadup Double Deuce Mac???
Eli, puttin in work, gettin it done!
Holdin it down in 2007.
Like T-Mac said, Gatorpilot.
T-Mac could write a book, but who would wanna read it brother?
Shout out to Uncle Pookie.
He just got his left testicle removed.
T-Mac loves ya Uncle Pookie!
Get well soon Dogg.
*T-Mac approved this message.
Hotty Toddy said:
posted on October 23, 2007 2:41 AM — 75.105.128.39 — link — abuse?
T-Mac #43,
I give Coach O until next season. If we don't go to a bowl, I want him out. And I imagine all the rest of us Rebel fans will be calling for his head.
Recruiting talent doesn't do squat if you don't utilize the players and put them to good use.
I'd rather get a beatdown week in and week out like we got from the Razorbacks, rather than have an "almost" victory.
You wanna know what the almost-victories mean against those teams like Florida, Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, LSU, etc. ? (from this season and last)
... that we're good enough to give a scare, but not good enough to pull the W. Better luck next time!
Talent? Sure... we got it... overloaded with it...
But we don't know how to win. All i'm looking forward to the rest of this season is potential upsets of Auburn this week, and LSU when they come to Oxford.
posted on October 23, 2007 6:53 AM — link — abuse? said:
There is a school of thought that says JoPa & Bowden finish the season tied, with either both winning or both losing their bowl, and ending the year tied. The theory goes that both retire and call it a career.
I don't subscribe to that, because I don't think either would be inclined to "go for the tie" in this scenario.
Of the two, I think FSU is in better shape post-Bowden than Penn State is after JoPa. Bowden's new staff is capable of sticking together and winning quickly, not sure you can say the same of the PSU staff if Jr. takes the reins.
Might be a topic for more discussion later in the year.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on October 23, 2007 8:13 AM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Agree, Kevin. Bowden isn't really anything more than a figurehead at FSU anyway.
I'm not sure about winning "quickly" part, but maybe winning "sooner."
How is it that FSU has had such terrible quarterbacks these past years? Do they really need to go meandering back and forth between Lee and Weatherford? It's time to try someone else. They're both awful.
posted on October 23, 2007 8:55 AM — link — abuse? said:
Gatorpilot - It's too simplistic to look at the record and presume that Bowden is now ineffective, just as it would be too simplistic to look at Zook last record and presume that he was effective.
Bowden is the CEO on the FSU staff, but that doesn't mean that he is not VERY ACTIVE in game prep and other elements. Just listening to his Monday Q&A's proves the man's still got it.
The QB situation is partly a QB situation, and partly an O-Line situation. The O-Line has been very poor for several years, with weaker recruiting classes (relative to years past) and injuries. FSU lacks the O-Line talent to have one guy out. They are ineffective blockers for the run, so the Noles are one-dimensional. The FSU QBs would be more effective if the defenses had any concern as to what they were going to do. That doesn't exist today, so the QB play suffers. I really do believe that you could put *almost* any college QB into the FSU system today and have limited effectiveness. The holes up front are just too glaring.
This would have been a great year to have someone like Tebow or Dan Kendra at QB, because -- at the very least -- they could fullback their way to four yards and keep an option on the table.
No, Bowden is not the problem. Unfortunately, there's no real clear indication that he is the solution, either.
Jimbo is the future of this team. I hope they are able to retain him.
TampaGator said:
posted on October 23, 2007 9:55 AM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
JenSteve/#39:
"...Selfish? Are you kidding? the state has an interest in fielding a competitive football team. We are not. We have not been for some time...."
How about short-sighted? Immature?
First, FSU is still relatively competitive--and they still haven't endured a LOSING season in 30+ years (ask Notre Dame Fan about being competetive).
Second, such ingratitude and impatience, even AFTER Coach Bowden revamped the coaching staff and let his OWN SON son take a walk off the plank?
(...hell, with fans like you and the guy who put the sign up on Bowden's property, who needs Gators and 'canes? I can't even muster up my ordinary animosity for the 'noles after reading this blog...)
Third, 5+ years from now, no one is going to care about a few extra wins. It will pale in comparison to Bowden being able to retire the winningest coach in CFB.
Just keeping it real; I'm pulling for JoPa to get the record back at the end of the day--for a number of reasosn (not out of hatred for Bowden)...
...but if Bowden were my guy (ie-coach of UF)--I'd back that horse for the duration of the race--especially after all he's meant to FSU.
My $.02.
b/t/w: do you remember UF's record in 1980? We seem to have recovered ok...
GO GATORS!!P.S.--the "state's interest" in fielding a competitive team (to the extent I'd even recognize one) is being satisfied by UF and USF. :)
Gatorpilot said:
posted on October 23, 2007 11:44 AM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Kevin: I agree with you about Fisher. The guy has proven he's a pretty good OC in the past.
But this is a bad year for his stock -- it's tenuous when you're a "hot" coordinator that has yet to take a head coaching job, and one or two more years of output like he has endured in '07 will really hurt both his candidacy for the FSU job and/or other head coaching gigs.
Still, if anyone *should* be able to turn things around, it's this cast.
It better start with recruiting and spring/fall practice. I am floored at how poor FSU's talent has become. I don't understand why they can't find a halfway decent quarterback. Ole Miss found Seth Adams as a senior walk-on. He's not NFL material, but damn, he's a pretty freaking good SEC quarterback in the grand scheme, especially given the guys he has to work with, and Ole Miss has been competitive against some strong teams this year (the Arkansas debacle notwithstanding.) Why can't FSU do that?
I fully expect we're going to see the Weatherford/Lee rotation until both guys graduate. It just seems pointless and futile to me. Neither one of them show any evidence of being able to put a series of complete games together, managing the offense to put them in a position to win.
FSU has a whole boatload of problems. I'm not convinced Bowden isn't part of the problem. This team has been on a downward decline for the last four years and there seems to be no indication it's getting better.
jonsey said:
posted on October 23, 2007 12:56 PM — 167.197.127.130 — link — abuse?
im not convinced that it's a "butt load" of problems. last time FSU, was FSU- was 4 years ago. now, look at the national rank in rushing yards that year. pretty good right? that was thanks to a man named Greg Jones. i believe if FSU can find a running back, and someone that can coach an offensive line, problem solved. if they can get 100 yards on the ground a game, it takes pressure off the QB's. it's not lack of talent at QB because FSU has went through 4 of them since the running game has been non effective. Rix, Sexton, Wetherford, and Lee. You can't say all of those guys had no talent, can you?
Zac said:
posted on October 23, 2007 1:56 PM — 209.36.193.14 — link — abuse?
Im surprised at what Im reading with regards to lack of talent at FSU, especially along the offensive line. While its true, the new coaches coming in are working with talent recruited prior to their arrival, the early word from these new coaches indicated decent talent was there when they arrived. For example, a lot was made of Rick Tricketts comments comparing the talent he used to work with at WVU and the seemingly superior talent he now works with at FSU. A lot was made as to how the lineman bought into his philosophy; there was a whole new attitude; during practice, linemen were moving defenders off the ball with greater regularity, etc.
Where I think the problem lies is not necessarily with the talent, but with the obvious new system brought in by the new coaches. Fisher has his own style of play. While theres no doubt he has to run his plays and play calling past Bowden, its still his system. If theres that big a difference between what Fisher ran at LSU and what used to be run at FSU, then, itll take at least a season or so for the players to pick it up. Thats no different for the offensive line and the new blocking schemes which come with new plays, not to mention getting used to their new mentor.
I contend the issue has been the fans over-all expectations have been unreasonable. With coaching changes come new philosophies, new plays, new formations, new routes for WRs, new holes for RBs to look for, as well as new blocking assignments and schemes for the offense. Essentially, when fans observe new coaches coming in, they have to accept the season may be a wash until the wrinkles get ironed out.
Consider Rich Rodriguezs 1st year at WVU with his new system. WVU went 3-8. Ron Zooks 1st year at IL was no picnic; Schiano at Rutgers had some lean years early on, Kragthorpes 1st year at Louisville isnt going well, and Robinson (SU) & Wannstedt (Pitt) are still having their problems. All things considered, FSU is not doing all that badly. Given things could get a lot worse, FSU fans might wanna show a little more patients. Just a thought.
posted on October 23, 2007 5:49 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse? said:
I've been trying to decide who uses more one sentence paragraphs, T-Mac or Gatorhippy. T-Mac, I think the crown is yours. We'll give you your award during halftime of Ole Miss's game against Auburn this weekend.
Not disparaging the content, however, just the conveyance. Don't hate the player, hate the game... :-)
Jon said:
posted on October 23, 2007 8:28 PM — 68.84.19.20 — link — abuse?
I've been on here pitching a fit for the past several years under the Jeff Bowden regime.
Gatorhippy, et al -- This is a different FSU football team and they are heading in a different direction. They are a QB away from being competitive with ANY team in college football and... if they manage the games right... it wouldn't surprise me to see them knock of Boston College and the Gators.
gatorhippy
posted on October 24, 2007 9:04 AM — 209.16.115.5 — link — abuse? said:
Orlando Sentinel's Mike Bianchi thinks it's time to put the the Riverboat Gambler out to pasture...
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/orl-bianchi2407oct24,0,6350059.column?coll=orl_tab02_layout
Gatorpilot said:
posted on October 24, 2007 9:06 AM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Jon: I'm sure you're kidding, because FSU is light years behind UF at many positions other than quarterback.
Offensive line? UF's is among the nation's best. They handled LSU all night. A freshman (Pouncey) and an unheralded senior (Tartt) handled Glenn Dorsey all night. By comparison, FSU's line can't run block or pass protect. They're awful.
Receivers? Again, you've got to be kidding. At least three -- probably four -- of Florida's WRs are going to be playing in the NFL within the next 3 years.
UF's defense isn't great this year but there's a ton of true freshmen and sophomores starting. They're very fast and athletic. They're going to be a lot better in '08. Already I think it's obvious that they would handle elite competition better than FSU. They already have.
Obviously Tebow is one of, if not the, best quarterbacks in the country. No comparison there, and I'm glad there's no attempt at argument.
I would argue that FSU is deficient at all positions, that the coaching isn't nearly as good (how is it we're an elite team after replacing 80% of our starters?) and the outlook is grim. Sorry, but them's the facts.
Jon said:
posted on October 24, 2007 9:28 PM — 68.84.19.20 — link — abuse?
Sorry, but them's the facts.
Yes if facts = your speculation.
Don't come crying the blues when all your theories go down the toilet and FSU marches over you (with their much less "talented" team and useless QB's)..
You can't rank any of our offensive athletes on what they accomplished during Jeff Bowden's tenure...or in the short present time of adapting to a new system... Jeffy had a knack for taking good NFL players and coaching them into mediocrity. It is going to take some time to undo 6-years of Jeff Bowden. I guarantee you Fisher will have FSU fixed up soon enough. Then we will be meeting undefeated #1, #2.. just like old times.
Enjoy your fun gators. It may feel good to vicariously live through watching us die... but... this program is being resurrected... and on Nov 24, you are going to learn that the hard way.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on October 25, 2007 12:27 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
Well, we are looking forward to that, Jon. Even if we've heard the same statement four years running now, I hope for both of our sakes that you're right, that FSU will show up this time.
UF has hung it's OOC scheduling hat on FSU. FSU has been so weak in the last four years that we're losing the ability to say we have a regularly scheduled out of conference game with a Top 25 opponent.
Forgive me if I'm less than optimistic about FSU's chances in this game. Remember what the score was last time ya'll showed up in Swamp? (Hint: 34-7.) Our team is much improved since then and FSU is about the same.
You can tell me that FSU will find a way to make it a respectable loss, and I wouldn't argue too much over that. They lost by only a TD in '06 despite fielding a vastly inferior team. Maybe this year they can do the same, but something tells me you're look at a 3-possession loss in Gainesville.
But to say they're going to win, much less "march over" UF just makes me chuckle. Get real, buddy.
Gatorpilot said:
posted on October 25, 2007 2:40 PM — 71.42.27.135 — link — abuse?
And by the way, some sobering facts that you're apparently not aware of, Jon:
FSU's record over last 29 games: 14 wins, 15 losses
FSU's ACC record: have lost 9 of their last 11 games... and the ACC is widely considered either the weakest or 2nd-weakest BCS conference in the country.
Care to re-assess?
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Zac said:
posted on October 21, 2007 10:07 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?I'm not at all surprised by the sign. Fans will be fans. That's the nature of the beast. Coaches know to take the good with the bad.
What surprises me were the reports from summer practices. The differences that newcomers Jimbo Fisher & Rick Trickett were making. There was talk of a whole new attitude among the team. Even the new coaches were pleased by the level of talent they were working with. I expected better. I know a lot of Knoles fans expected better.
I'd hate to see Bobby B leave college football every bit as much as I'd hate to see Joe Pa go. I can't imagine it being much different as when I heard Red Skelton & Bob Hope had passed this earth.
If Bobby Bowden leaves college football, I'd like to see it done on his terms; not the terms of disgruntled fans. Just a thought.