April 8, 2008
Ranking the BCS Coaches
TSN's Tom Dienhart, who knows more about college football than you (wink, wink) and yet still errs on which teams are in which conference (ahem), has begun his annual series of ranking the top coaches in each of the BCS conferences.
His full "analysis" is offered up for every BCS coach at the conference links.
1. Jim Grobe, Wake Forest. The bottom line is this: No one does more with less at a place that had mastered losing before he arrived. Grobe's 20 wins over the last two years are the most in school annals. The ACC title and Orange Bowl berth he led the Deacs to in 2006 was one of the greatest college football accomplishments in the last 25 years. Is it any wonder major BCS programs knock on his door all the time?2. Frank Beamer, Virginia Tech
3. Bobby Bowden, Florida State
4. Tom O'Brien, N.C. State
5. Paul Johnson, Georgia Tech
6. Al Groh, Virginia
7. Tommy Bowden, Clemson
8. Butch Davis, North Carolina
9. David Cutcliffe, Duke
10. Ralph Friedgen, Maryland
11. Jeff Jagodzinski, Boston College
12. Randy Shannon, Miami. His hiring look dubious. And his debut only cast more doubt on his ability. He's a player's coach and recruiting machine, but is he feared by his troops? Give Shannon credit for landing defensive coordinator Bill Young from Kansas. But will the offense ever take flight?
For those keeping score for the ACC coaches at home, Deinhart has fallen out of love with Friedgen - big time. His #6 rankings and comments last year ("...the quintessential "ball coach" who has forgotten more Xs and Os than most coaches know. The Fridge combines that know-how with a hard-edge East Coast toughness. His teams always are prepared. Gotta love the Fridge. ") are a marked contrast to this year's #10 ranking and his assessment ("The Fridge is running on empty.") I think I tend to agree more with 2008 Tom than 2007 Tom, this time.
1. Bob Stoops, Oklahoma. The postseason foibles notwithstanding (he is 0-fer in his last four BCS games), Stoops remains one of the nation's best. Witness his 97-22 mark and five Big 12 crowns in nine seasons in Norman. Stoops' problem: Spoiling the Sooner fan base by leading the program to the national title in his second year on the job.2. Mack Brown, Texas
3. Mark Mangino, Kansas
4. Mike Leach, Texas Tech
5. Dan Hawkins, Colorado
6. Gary Pinkel, Missouri
7. Art Briles, Baylor
8. Mike Sherman, Texas A&M
9. Bo Pelini, Nebraska
10. Mike Gundy, Oklahoma State
11. Gene Chizik, Iowa State
12. Ron Prince, Kansas State
I can't argue the 2008 version of the Big XII list, although I hold Pelini in higher regard than Sherman. Deinhart wiffed badly in ranking Bill Callahan as third last year. There's been a lot of turnover in the Big XII, so it will be interesting to see how the coaching ranks might shake out over the next few seasons.
1. Randy Edsall, UConn. His great body of work gets lost in the national media fawning over other Big East programs. But close inspection shows Edsall, a smart mind with an astute eye for talent, has built a strong foundation buoyed by excellent facilities.2. Greg Schiano, Rutgers
3. Brian Kelly, Cincinnati
4. Steve Kragthorpe, Louisville
5. Jim Leavitt, South Florida
6. Dave Wannstedt, Pitt
7. Greg Robinson, Syracuse
8. Bill Stewart, West Virginia
I have to take exception with the 2008 Big East list, and I'll call Deinhart's 2007 list into evidence. First and foremost, Brian Kelly is the best (remaining) coach in the Big East - hands down. That said, I don't understand how Schiano, Kelly, and Kragthorpe all leap-frogged USF's Leavitt year-over-year. Leavitt built the Bulls by hand and set a record for time from I-A status to Top 25 (breaking Boise State's mark). USF melted under the white-hot spotlight last season, but going from no program a decade or so ago to #2... that's not a fluke.
1. Pete Carroll, USC. He only has built the premier program in America, that's all. And don't tell me he's in a cushy job that is set up for success. Remember Paul Hackett? Larry Smith? Yes, Carroll has advantages, but with an energy and mojo unseen in any other coach, he has built a talent-laden power.2. Dennis Erickson, Arizona State
3. Mike Bellotti, Oregon
4. Mike Riley, Oregon State
5. Jeff Tedford, Cal
6. Rick Neuheisel, UCLA
7. Jim Harbaugh, Stanford.
8. Tyrone Willingham, Washington
9. Paul Wulff, Washington State
10. Mike Stoops, Arizona
No real arguments about the Pac10 list. Everyone expects Neuheisel to be in the top three very quickly, but it is hard to say (today) that he is a better coach than Bellotti, Riley, and Tedford. If I had to pick one coach to win one game for me at any talent level, I would probably pick Erickson. That said, the Pac 10 is just absolutely stacked with coaching cred.
1. Jim Tressel, Ohio State. First, there's the 2002 national championship. Second, there are the four Big Ten titles. Third, there's the 6-1 mark vs. Michigan. More big things loom this fall, too. It's good to be Tressel. It just makes you wonder what John Cooper was doing all of those years, doesn't it? No doubt: In Tressel we trust.2. Rich Rodriguez, Michigan
3. Joe Tiller, Purdue
4. Kirk Ferentz, Iowa
5. Bret Bielema, Wisconsin
6. Ron Zook, Illinois
7. Mark Dantonio, Michigan State
8. Joe Paterno, Penn State
9. Pat Fitzgerald, Northwestern
10. Tim Brewster, Minnesota
11. Bill Lynch, Indiana
I can't argue the top two - Tressel and Coach Rod are the class of the Big 10 - but Bielema and Zook are interchangable at the three/four spot. After that, I think you could put them all in a hat and come out even on the draw. Dienhart claims that Paterno's ranking is not based on his legacy, but.... I'm sorry - PSU is not on the rise.
1. Mark Richt, Georgia. Here is all you need to know: Richt is fourth among active I-A coaches with a .791 winning percentage (72-19). Want more? He's one of just six coaches to win two SEC crowns in his first five years. On top of all of this, Richt is a terrific human being who knows how to motivate.2. Steve Spurrier, South Carolina
3. Urban Meyer, Florida
4. Nick Saban, Alabama
5. Les Miles, LSU
6. Tommy Tuberville, Auburn
7. Phillip Fulmer, Tennessee
8. Houston Nutt, Ole Miss
9. Bobby Johnson, Vanderbilt
10. Bobby Petrino, Arkansas
11. Rich Brooks, Kentucky
12. Sylvester Croom, Mississippi State
I can't question Richt as the best coach in the SEC. He may very well be the best coach in the nation.
But the rest of the list? Eh... There's no way that Spurrier is a top three coach, just as there is no way that Petrino is a bottom three coach. I know that Tommy Six-Fingers gets mocked considerably, but he is still one of the best coaches in the country - and putting him at number six is a huge disservice. And Saban at number four?! Puh-leaze!!! How 'bout.... Richt, Meyer, Tuberville, Miles, Petrino, Nutt, Brooks, Spurrier, Saban, Johnson, Croom, Fulmer,
Comments:
BayouBengal said:
posted on April 8, 2008 5:55 PM — 72.149.254.106 — link — abuse?
ROTFLMAO!!!!
First off... "Tom Diehart" is a bull sh*t name!(kinda like "Wink Martindale")
Ok, yeah....the ACC is a hard conference to have to rank BCS coach's, but c'mon Tommy Bowden in the 7 spot is way too low! And after seeing the recruiting class that Randy Shannon put together for the U, says that he's probably going to rival Jimbo Fisher for the ACC's best deffense!(just sayin)
As for the Big 12!
Close.....but no cigar! Yeah, its gonna be Bo Pelini's 1st year, so obviously he's unproven as a HC, but everyone knows how succesfull Bo's deffense's have ALWAYS been! He brought the Chinese Bandits back to LSU, so expect him to give new life to the Blackshirts at Nebraska as well! (IMO this at least gives him the 5th spot)The BEAST!
Sooooo Jim Leavitt of South FL gets absolutely no credit for building a damn strong team that: 1)Didn't even exist 10 years ago
2)Has bounced from Div 1 FCS, to Div 1 FBS, then joined CUSA, and now are in the BEAST.
3)Also, recruiting must be near impossible when you have to compete with UF, FSU, and Miami!
4)Remember when the Bulls were ranked at #2 last season! (yeah it was brief, and maybe by default....but still!)The BIG 10(1)
Tressell the obvious shoe in, but Rich Rod at #2? Not yet Tom Diehart(with a vengence)! The BEAST is no where near the prestige of the Big 10.....so RR is going to have to do a little more than sign a contract to be ranked up there with the Sweater Vest! I vote Ron Zook gets 2nd in the BIG 10!The PAC 10
Ehhh, looks about right! I do like what Jim Harbaugh is doing at Stanford though, so we'll have to wait and see if that USC victory in '07 was a complete fluke or not!The SEC
Ok, I promise this isn't biased at all!
But, Ima gonna saaaaay...Lesticles gets the nod for #1....and Saban gets the 12th spot!!!(what....he's harboring criminals for gods sakes!)Geaux Tigers!
Zac said:
posted on April 8, 2008 6:02 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
Zac's take:
ACC - I don't think anyone can argue with the top 2. I think Bowden at 3 is up for debate. Is he even really coaching anymore? Jeff Jagodzinski deserves props for a great job as a 1st year coach at BC, but does he rank up there with the next 3? Davis, Johnson, O'brien: I realize results are everything, but in my opinion, these 3 are in a dead heat - damn good coaches all. Arguably, Tommy B could be ranked with them. Groh manages one decent season among a passel of lousy - mediocre ones and gets ranked 6th - NO WAY!
Big 12 - I can't argue with Kevin at all here.
Big East - IMHO - Levitt, Edsall, Kelly, Schiano, Stewart, Kragethorp, Wannstedt, Robinson. Considering what Jagodzinski did in his 1st year at BC vs. what Kragethorp did in his 1st year at Louisville with close to the same personnel, he's lucky I didn't rank him with Robinson. Biased as I am, I can only rank Stewart 5th on the strength of his having pulled his staff & team together for the big upset in the Fiesta Bowl, given the distractions surrounding the MI & Rodriguez debacle. Though Coach Stew has put together a fine staff, he still hasn't proven himself...yet.
Pac-10 - Again, few arguments here, and none regarding Kevin's comments on Erickson. I am tempted to swap Tedford with Neuheisel, and Willingham with Wulff.
Big Ten(11) - I can't argue with Tressel. I can argue with Rogriguez, especially given his team armed with his system hasn't snapped the ball as yet in an official game. Biased as I am, this pick is more than pre-mature. It's ABSOLUTELY OUTRAGEOUS!!! Ahem, as is Paterno ranked 8th, given he's done much better than Bowden in recent years. Lynch ranked dead last is a travesty. I guess there's no justice in this league.
SEC - I know I'm going to bring out the Gator Mates with this one, but here's my top 6: Miles, Richt, Meyer, Tuberville, Croom, & Fulmer. Do as you will with the rest.
Tomcat said:
posted on April 8, 2008 7:22 PM — 68.94.174.184 — link — abuse?
Good thread Kev, I've taken issue with some of Tom Dieharts articles in the past.He's a Big Ten-Purdue guy, so naturally his opinions, much like the rest of us is very bias.
Big-10 Looks like to me that
#1 Tressel
#2 Zook, ya they lost to Missu
& USC, but they beat OSU
#3 Bielema
#4 Paterno
#5 Rod
#6 Ferentz
Yall can fight over the rest,I cant give a first year coach higher than 5 in the league sorry guys too many changes etc. etc. They beat the Buckeyes etc and then maybe #1 next yearXII
#1 Mangino
I really dont even like the guy, but he did more with less and finished 12-1 and had a great Bowl win
#2 Stoops
#3 Brown
#4 Leach-Hawkins tied both beat OU
#5 Pinkle outstanding season
#6 Briles
#7 Gundy He is #1 with the press & playersSEC
no arguments with the amount of coaching talent in this league
Diehart has Croom at # 12 WTF ?
Petrino is #12
Yall can fight over 1 thru 11 okay
Nutt is somewhere in the middle of the pack IMOBig E
#1 Levitt
#2 Wannstedt
Okay let it fly
Hookem-Horns
Regan said:
posted on April 8, 2008 11:02 PM — 75.182.53.208 — link — abuse?
I generally have difficulty judging a coach at a school after only one year, and believe that brand new coaches shouldn’t even be listed in stuff like this because no one knows who will lead BC to a 10 win season and who will lead Louisville home for the holidays.
I’ll try to stick to the conferences I know: the ACC and SEC
ACC: Tommy Bowden should be allowed a variable rating, have it hover from #1- #5or something.
1-Beamer (VT is solidly successful)
2-Grobe (WF is recently successful)
3- Friedgen (Terminally average)
4-Groh (Terminally average)
5-B Bowden (recent scandals, cupcakes. Here’s hoping he rights the ship soon. CFB just isn’t the same with FSU being weaker.)
Variable-T Bowden (and please keep your mouth shut while we’re at it, TB…)Shannon – No one doubted RS would have difficulties bringing the ‘Canes back. The only thing that even gives me pause about him is 48-0, because that defies reason in virtually every way conceivable, and yet I saw it with my own eyes.
Davis – Too good of a coach not to do well, although he picked a bad school to try at.
O’Brien – Bizarre move to begin with, I see many 7-5 seasons in his future.
Jagodzinski – Not a clue. BC is a different bird than the rest of the ACC.
Cutcliffe – See Davis (UNC)
Johnson – He will do well, although I believe he won’t use a carbon copy of his Navy offense. I expect GT to resemble WVU on the field soon enough.
SEC: No one can properly rank the SEC coaches. For cryin’ out loud, I’ve got Urban Meyer at 5th and that’s just messed up.1-Richt (Bandwagon reasons)
2-Fulmer (Tennessee is my team in the SEC. Excuse the bias, please.)
3-Tuberville (Respect coaches that win. Fear coaches that do better against top 25 opponents than they do Vandy.)
4-Miles (I hate the bastard, but he’s the reigning 2-Loss National Champion…here’s the darned kudos…)
5-Meyer (Fifth…no idea how this could happen…don’t hate me, Gators, hate the fact that Mom went to UT…)
6-Brooks (We’ll see how he is without Woodson)
7-Spurrier (He gave up play-calling duties to his son…I have no idea where SoS is going right now, but Carolina fans are more baffled than arrogant for this time of year…
8-Croom (Rough league for a good coach)
9- Johnson (see Croom)Saban – Either he wins the 2009-2015 NC’s, or he’s in trouble. Grumbling will commence in the Georgia Dome after the Tide misses out on an undefeated September, though…
Petrino – He’ll do well, but won’t dominate an SEC lined with equal coaching talent.
Nutt – Honestly, for a second I had no idea which team he was coaching at. He’ll bring Ole Miss back to Arkansas’ level just in time to interview for Croom’s job in 3 years.
Bleed Crimson
posted on April 8, 2008 11:49 PM — 72.146.25.152 — link — abuse?
said:
I am officially announcing my retirement from fanblogs.com
Kevin Doanhue, head of the site, believes Rich Brooks and Houston Nutt are BOTH better coaches than Nick Saban.
before i leave, ill leave you with MY sec coach rankings:
1. Nick Saban
2. Mark Richt
3. Les Miles
4. Urban Meyer
5. Steve Spurrier
6. Phil Fulmer
7. Tommy Tuberville
8. Houston Nutt
9. Bobby Petrino
10. Sylvester Croom
11. Rich Brooks
12. Bobby Johnsonlaugh all you want, but lets not base our coach rankings on just last season and our expectations of next season.
Lest you forget, Mark Richt has coached the Bulldogs for 7 seasons and has yet to win a NC.
Nick Saban on the other hand, took a 3-win LSU team and won a NC only 4 seasons later.RazzMaTazz said:
posted on April 9, 2008 1:05 AM — 70.137.190.212 — link — abuse?
If each of the ACC ADs came to me and asked if I'd like to trade coaches for my Tigers' Tommy Bowden, I'd trade for:
Frank Beamer (who built a top tier football program from squat, and owns Tommy.)
Jim Grobe (who won an ACC title with little player-talent or tradition).
Tom O'Brien (who owned Bowden while at cold, little BC).
Butch Davis (who's a scary ex-NFL coach).
Jeff Jagodinski (who already beat Bowden in 1st year on his way to the ACCCG).That makes Bowden 6th (at best) in my rankings. Now the Bobby Bowden thing is hard, because Bobby is a legend who used to be better than Tommy will ever be, but Bobby is past his prime and rumor has it that Bobby is more of a figurehead who just passed the reigns to Jimbo Fisher. I'd probably take a Bobby/Jimbo combo over Tommy-- especially if you threw in Bobby's trophy case. So that kinda makes Tommy 7th in my "trade-ya" based rankings. Though one more year of failure by Tommy, and I'd be willing to trade anybody.
Considering that Clemson has finished an average of about 5th in the expanded ACC (including tie-breaker criteria), and Tommy has done less with more resources than most of the others, I think it's pretty easy to justify a 6th or 7th place ranking for Tommy Bowden.
Zac said:
posted on April 9, 2008 4:49 AM — 209.36.193.14 — link — abuse?
BB (#2) & TC (#4), thanks for reminding me that I somehow managed to forget Ron Zook. I agree, he definitely makes more sense at #2 or #3 than does RR. He's done a great job with the Illini in a short time. That puts Paterno at #4 behind Zook & Bielema, which is about where I figured he should be.
Big Tide said:
posted on April 9, 2008 7:07 AM — 12.208.88.211 — link — abuse?
Bleed Crimson, have patience and don't retire. You'll miss out on the wonderful time we'll have in the years to come.
Best thread we've had for the entire off season. Why is Bobby Bowden mentioned? He's not even a real coach, he's sort of a 1/2 coach isn't he? There needs to at least be an * with Jimbo out to the side.
Mark Richt at number 1? Not ready to buy that, but maybe this year he'll make me believe.
Ron Zook is the best coach in the Big 10, hands down.
AUTigerFan08 said:
posted on April 9, 2008 4:02 PM — 74.239.251.222 — link — abuse?
Bleed Crimson
Is your list based on how much money the coaches
make? The Reason I ask is that is the only way I can see Saban as #1. Not that he is a bad coach but not #1 in the SEC. Considering that two other coaches have won MNC since he has and one undefeated season by another how can you justify this ranking?
My list for SEC coaches
1 Mark Richt this could be the year
2 Les Miles ( hey winning the MNC has to count for something right)
3 Urban Myer has Florida in the hunt this year
4 Tommy Tuberville As good as any of the top three just needs to bring home the hardware
5 Sly Croom Come on people this guy is doing it the right way with less and still winning
6 Phil Fulmer always puts a competive team on the field
7 Houston Nutt Arkansas will regret this in the near future
8 Rich Brooks Made kentucky more than a BB school
9 Steve Spurrier Hasn't gotten SC over the hump YET!
10 Nick Saban I expect him to rise on this list after this year but just can't give him any better yet
11 Bobby Johnson what can you say about Vandy
12 Bobby Petrino was a great OC but let's see how he is as a HC in the SEC
Bleed Crimson
posted on April 10, 2008 12:02 AM — 72.146.25.152 — link — abuse? said:
okay i cant retire. haha
AUTigerFan:
no, my rankings are not salary-based. they are talent-based.
Are your rankings team-based?im sorry but i just cant see how so many of you have no problem ranking NICK SABAN as one of the bottom three coaches in the SEC. i just dont get it. i mean MAYBE i can understand it if youre just basing your rankings on last year, but i thought this was an overall coach ranking.
sorry tigerfan but your rankings are the worst ive seen so far.
your reason for ranking Bobby Petrino below Bobby Johnson is "lets see how Petrino does in the SEC???"
are you freakin kidding me?anyone else that believes Bobby Johnson is a better coach than Bobby Petrino should never post on here again.
Ramblin' Gator said:
posted on April 10, 2008 12:48 AM — 74.185.133.40 — link — abuse?
Some random thoughts...
The ACC seems misaligned to me. Jagodzinski had a phenomenal debut season and seems misplaced at 11th in the conference. I'm thrilled that Paul Johnson is placed at 5th, but I really would like to see him coach his first BCS-level game before ranking him in the top half of the conference. Friedgen has been off recently, but I think he's a very capable coach. Really, the whole list seems a bit off to me.
The Big 12 looks like it's ranked about right to me, but where's Corn-Hole Chris? Shouldn't he be here to complain that Pelini is ranked so low, and that I'm so negative, and that this is REALLY a Nebraska thread and the rest of us shouldn't even be here?
I hadn't considered how strong the coaching ranks are in the Big East - very impressive!
Pac-10: well, what can I say? It's Pete Caroll at the top and everybody else tied for second.
It's a little sad and shocking to see Joe Paterno ranked 8th in the Big10or11.
The SEC seems close to correct, though I think the ranking is a bit generous to SOS and too stingy on Petrino. It's a bit like the Big East: an embarassment of riches for coaching talent in the SEC.
On top of all of this, Richt is a terrific human being who knows how to motivate.
True, but can he motivate without breaking the rules, getting flagged, lying about the incident, then apologizing for the incident and claiming he never intended for the team to run on the field?
Husker Chris said:
posted on April 10, 2008 12:53 AM — 98.16.146.89 — link — abuse?
Wow! Bitter bitter little gator. Fanblog editors, where is the policing of the "we require that comments be civil, respectful, and on-topic"? Or is this a one rule for lunatic gator fans and another rule for everyone else situation?
Regan said:
posted on April 10, 2008 1:51 AM — 75.182.53.208 — link — abuse?
Bleed Crimson (#12):
I understand your points on Saban and Petrino; I think neither coach is really a 'known commodity' just yet, I wasn't going to make my SEC list any more awkward than it was with lots of known commodities...
Both were phenomenal at their last college gigs, but time will have to tell whether or not the "Spurrier Effect" (true lightning only strikes once and can't be duplicated) will hinder either of them.
Saban at least has going for him the "Meyer Clause" (a good coach with a winner's mindset that leaps around every 2 years or so doesn't get into the habit of losing).
If this is the case, though, it's bad news for 'Bama after the 2009 NC, though...
1st_and_NOLE
posted on April 10, 2008 8:01 AM — 71.14.108.232 — link — abuse? said:
The author (Tom Dienhart) of this list did it in a very flawed way.
He's clearly using the entire careers of some coaches to rank them and recent success of others.
Example:
Steve Spurrier being #2 at SC. That's clearly based on SS's career and what he did at Florida. SS certainly hasn't earned the #2 spot for anything he's done this decade. In fact, this decade Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, and Les Miles have all won NC's and Tommy T went undefeated and got robbed - all ranked lower then SS. So, it's obvious he's taking into account SS's entire career.
If Tom D. is going to use career accomplishments, his lists are awful. You can't use entire careers and put Bobby Bowden at #3 in the ACC.
However, in the case of Bobby Bowden, he's ranking him based on FSU since 2000.
So, he's using different criteria for different coaches.
Hence, the entire thing is flawed.
40 Acres of Burnt Orange
posted on April 10, 2008 9:02 AM — 192.94.94.105 — link — abuse? said:
Heres my rankings for the big 12 coaches. Very similar to OU-Ron's:
1. Stoops 97-22 @ OU 4-5 in bowl games. As much as i hate to say it the guy gets his team ready for the big conference games. Once he can appply that to the bowl games he will be set.
2. The Mack 103-25 @ UT 7-3 in bowl games. just beat OU and A&M in the same season and ill be happy.
3. The Pirate Leach - 65-37 @ TT 5-3 in bowl games. Always competitive. Once this guy gets a good defense the raiders will be a force to be reckoned with in the south.
4. Pinkel- 49-37 @ Mizzou 2-2 in bowl games. Having Chase for another year may be nice, but having a date in Austin could give the texas boi a little hangover.
5. Mark (im thinking Arby's) Mangino 37-36 @ rock chalk jayhawk, KU 2-1 in bowl games. A lot of teams will have KU on their radar this year. And with dates with the boomers and burnt orange expect the jayhawks to slowly drift back into mediocrity.
6. Mike (im a man, im 40!) Gundy 18-19 @ OK St 2-0 in bowl games. Gundy has shown signs of promise, but as long as stoops is in norman he will the bastard step-child in the OK.
7. The Prince of Manhattan 12-13 @ K-St 0-1 in bowl games. Texas always has a tought time with K-St. Give him a couple of years and he will make noise in the North.
8. The Hawk in Boulder 8-17 @ CU, 0-1 in bowl games. Well he stole Scott from TX he took CU to a bowl and upset OU. Their schedule this year looks pretty scary. Expect a similar situation as Kansas.
9. Gene (shoulda stayed in Austin) Chizik 3-9 @ Iowa St. 0-0 in bowl games? BOWL GAMES? Man i don't know how anyone could ever help Iowa St. Why hasn't this team joined the Big 10 yet?
10. Pelini at least he has a ring from LSU.
11. Briles can a former Boomer turn around the doormat program of the south? Could happen. 2 former boomers have been successful so far. Mangino @ KU, Leach @TT.
12 Sherman this aint the NFL buddy and good luck trying to satisy those rabid aggies fan whose expectations are much like Arkansas fans way beyond the realm of reality.HookEmHorns!
jonsey said:
posted on April 10, 2008 9:10 AM — 167.197.127.130 — link — abuse?
SEC
1. Richt
2. Meyer
3. Les Miles
4. Saban
5. Tuberville
6. Spurrier
7. Croom
8. Fulmer
9. Nutt
10. Johnson
11. Brooks
12. petrinoPetrino shouldn't even be in the SEC. he doesnt deserve it. arkansas was just so damn desperate. i hope Petrino gets a big helping of sec this coming year.
AUTigerFan08 said:
posted on April 10, 2008 12:06 PM — 74.239.251.222 — link — abuse?
Bleed Crimson
I ranked Petino at the bottom because he is hasn't couched a game in the SEC yet so I don't have any anything to compare him too. I didn't consider he's tenure at L'ville or ATL. Not that I think B.Johnson is better just there's nothing to compare him too yet.
Now if you want to diss my list at least I didn't put my teams coach at the top of the list like you did. Your's is extremeely bias. Mine is based more on reality than delusions like yours.
And if you read the entire post I clearly stated that I expected Nick Saban to move up the list. Given his past SEC success.
And to quote Regan he might have the "Spurrier Effect". So until he has some substanial success at Bama I can't rank him any higher.
And anyone who believes that Nick Saban is the best coach in the SEC right now should never post on here again.
This and my other post are merely my opinons I didn't attack you personally. But if you want to play that way then fine with me.
" your rankings are the worst I've seen so far"
I guess that's because I don't have my head up Nick Saban's ..... well you get my point.
When he win's the SEC at Bama then I won't have any problem with him being at the top.
But even K'Hue had a problem with him being ranked at #4 in the list from the article. So I am not alone with my opinion that he is not at the top of the SEC coaches...Yet. Give him a few years and I expect him to be right in the running but not this year. And yes it's based on his entire SEC career. He's only got 2 good years in the SEC. Gratnted he rebuilt LSU and should do the same thing a Bama but then again he may have just been lighting in a bottle only time will tell.RazzMaTazz said:
posted on April 10, 2008 2:42 PM — 70.137.190.212 — link — abuse?
Obviuosly its tough to come up with a perfect ranking. Do you ding a good coach (like Spurrier) because he hasn't really succeeded yet at a non-football school (like SoCar) or at a school with high academic standards like Stanford? Do you exalt Meyer for immediate success at an already-rich program? My guess is that Dienhart is using the same kind of "who-would-I-rather-have-coaching-my-team" reasoning that I used in my earlier post (#7) about Tommy Bowden.
For example, Bobby Bowden and Joe Paterno have had enormous success in their careers. But who would you rather have coaching your team next year, Jim Grobe (who won an ACC title with zero resources) or Bobby Bowden (who has FSU floundering despite top-tier recruiting classes and ample resources)? Ron Zook or JoePa?
I'm not saying that I agree with Dienhart's rankings, but I could imagine him thinking, "Partially based on history, and partly despite history, right now, I'd take A over B, unless B does something to change my mind."
TampaGator said:
posted on April 10, 2008 4:09 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
1st n Nole/#17:
"...He's clearly using the entire careers of some coaches to rank them and recent success of others..."
Respectfully disagree; he's doing nothing clearly. IMO, without any elaboration of the criteria he bases his rankings on (he puts them in a numbered slot, and explains why they're there--not what criteria he was measuring before he "ranked" them), he's essentially ranking his favorites. He should've called the lists:
"My favorite SEC/ACC/Big X/...coaches"
That woulda been a little more forthright, though admittedly a lot less compelling in terms of fueling discussion.
My $.02
GO GATORS!!Zac said:
posted on April 10, 2008 5:31 PM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
Bleed Crimson, I for one am glad you're sticking around, and I'm no more bothered by your bias than I am by that of AUTiger, any of the Gator Mates, Spartacus, or TE (to name a few). This is Fanblogs, where we take freedom of the press and freedom of speech to whole new heights. You have the right to speak your heart, so enjoy it while the freedom still exists.
Ranking coaches is as difficult as ranking entire programs. Few coaches have been with the same program throughout their respective careers. When they retire it becomes easy, as we critics can now look at an entire career under a microscope and determine in our own way to what level a given coach has achieved greatness. While they're active, however, it's more difficult.
Does one consider the previous accolades of a coach who's career seems to be waning, and it's reflected in his team at a level of success far less than it arguably should be, or do you take the attitude, "What have you done for me lately?", and rank the coach on recent accomplishments? Great coaches have lousy years; lesser coaches have great years. How do we make the distinction until the coach is retired?
Case in point: All bias considered, I think Don Nehlan was a great coach. He took an average, however competitive program, turned it up a notch, put it on the map, kept it there, and produced two undefeated teams (regular season) and got them arguably to 2 NC games. A lot of you won't agree with me because he never won a NC, holds the record for longest consecutive bowl loosing streak, or both. I also happen to think Lloyd Carr is a great coach. He even won a NC. Despite that, a lot of MI fans will disagree (including MGoBlue) due to his record against OSU. It depends upon the criteria against which they're judged.
So, I'm in agreement and on-board with 1st) Define the criteria, then 2nd) rank the coaches against that criteria. It seems as though Tom Dienhart would have known better, doesn't it.
Tomcat said:
posted on April 10, 2008 8:25 PM — 68.94.174.184 — link — abuse?
#18 40 Acres
Really enjoyed your list and mostley agree
The only reason I put Mark #1 was that there were so many disbeleivers, these guys couldnt beat Baylor and what an amazing 2007 season topped off with a big bowl win.
everybody read #12 true about A&M
If I was to make another list I'd copy yours-somewhat, When you look at this league
K St, Iowa St, Ok St, Colo
Have relatively new coaches
Baylor, A&M and Neb 1st year coaches
The XII is a scary place, kinda have to wait & see. Remember the good ole days when you would kinda circle 3 or 4 games, Well now you get to circle all of them, including Ark, Missu, KU, OU, TTech, T A&M,Colo, Ok St etc etc
Zac didnt take the bait, when I put Wansteent #2 in the Big E, it was just a jab I actually really like Schiano at #2
Hookem-Horns
Zac said:
posted on April 11, 2008 2:35 AM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
Tomcat, ya bastage, I wuz wundering where you were going with that ranking. Were we to be serious for a second, you could argue Dave Wannstedt should be last in the Big East. He has been with Pitt for 3 full seasons. On paper, he inherited a good crop and has landed the top recruiting class in the Big East 2 years straight. His team had even been pre-season ranked twice.
Despite this, Wannstedt is 16-19 in 3 seasons; his team suffered embarrassing losses to Navy & OH and has had loosing streaks as high as 5 games. The only reason I rank Wannstedt higher than Robinson (Syracuse) is due to the fact that Wannstedt can recruit, and Robinson hasn't won 10 games with the Orange in 3 seasons.
Now, Wannstedt likely bought a couple more years on the strength of his win at WVU last season. I have to believe Greg Robinson is gone after next season should his team suffer through another loosing season.
Which brings me to my issues with Nick Saban. If you look at his record (99-48-1, 2 SEC Championships, 1 NC, 4-5 bowl record) one would think none to shabby. I have to wonder what he told the Spartan faithful when he took the job there, because he really fed a banquet of Rodriguez-like rhetoric to the LSU faithful when he started there after 5 seasons with MI St.
After 2 unsuccessful season with the Dolphins, Saban got more attention lying about the Bamma job (at one point his interest in it, at another point his having NOT accepted it) than he did in taking it. So, the guy makes me wonder.
Like Wannstedt at Pitt, Saban inherited a seriously talent laden team at AL. He's also put together 2 outstanding recruiting classes, both arguably tops in the country. 7-6 (includes bowl win) isn't bad for a 1st year coach. But then, Wannstedt's team, after an 0-3 start, went 5-3 the rest of the way in his 1st year, yet he hasn't gotten any better. Rodriguez, on the other hand went 3-8 in his 1st year followed with a 9-4 2nd year.
The point is we don't know how Saban's team will fair this year. It would be nice to speculate, given they beat AK, CO, & TN, while narrowly losing to GA & LSU. But, they also lost to MS St, a not so well respected FL St, & LA Monroe. I need to see how his team gets through this season before I could consider ranking him higher than 9th of the coaches in the SEC.
There is one thing Saban did for which I now have a great deal of appreciation. After Rich Rodriguez turned down Bamma's $2 M offer, Saban came in and accepted the job for $4 M. That's gotta really chap Rich Rod's ass.
U. of S. C. 1978 said:
posted on April 11, 2008 11:42 AM — 97.82.175.124 — link — abuse?
I think this is a little bit better than a pre-season poll. I'm not quite sure why. It just seems like the quantification might be more accurate for some some reason.
It is still a hoot however and I am considering betting it all in Vegas based on my new top coach system.Tomcat said:
posted on April 13, 2008 10:36 AM — 68.94.174.184 — link — abuse?
Zac We know it takes time for a coach do develop his perspective program, but how long does one have.I thought that Pitt's hire of Wannstedt was a good move a couple of years ago and now it makes you wonder.He is defenitly located in an area known for producing alot of great atheletees and given his experences and name recognition you would think he'd have no problem in the recruitment circles. As you pointd out, that on paper he has done well in that area and given the talent should have somewhat of an advantage over others.
The college game is alot different than the pros when it comes to coaching, because its more important to be an inspirational leader, than an X's & O's strategist. Its probably not the gameplan that needs fixing, but the mental attitude of the team. In other words its probably not that he's getting outcoached, but that the others seem to find a way to motivate their players. I'm in agreement with you that the win over W.V. kinda proves that they have what it takes to beat tough competition. They have everything in place to be successful and this season will be a make or break year for the Panthers and their coach.
Adios TomcatBleed Crimson
posted on April 14, 2008 12:31 AM — 72.146.25.152 — link — abuse? said:
allllright.
yall want recent achievments?
how about landing the nation's #1 recruiting class after going 7-6. youve gotta be a DAMN good recruiter to pull that off. and any coach that can recruit THAT well should at least, IMO, be in the top 5 in the SEC.
that being said, some of you might be concerned with how well he'll develop that talent. thats when you take into account his past coaching accomplishments...
i mean you give spurrier two or three top 10 recruiting classes and i guarantee you hed be going to a bcs bowl. recruiting is a HUGE deal.I'll also just go ahead and throw this out there as well:
any college coach that has been offered an NFL gig is OBVIOUSLY one of the best college coaches in the country, because im willing to bet that whoever decides to make those offers knows just a little bit about coaching talent. and there are 3 in the SEC that i know of:
Saban
Spurrier
PetrinoZac said:
posted on April 14, 2008 6:48 AM — 209.36.193.14 — link — abuse?
Bleed Crimson, I’m not certain using Petrino & Spurrier as examples strengthens your arguments about Saban, especially given each has done the same thing almost equally well. By that I mean each was with a successful program for at least 4 seasons; each went to the NFL, where none of them were successful, before returning to college ball. Without any doubt, each has proven to be a solid college football coach; none have proven to be decent at the NFL level.
Now, consider Steve Spurrier. Following his 2nd stab in the NFL, he’s 21-16 over 3 seasons with SC. By comparison, Nick Saban is 7-6, which is arguably on track with Spurrier, or as I’ve said in an earlier post, Wannstedt. Then again, as I’ve said earlier, this season he could surpass what Rodriguez did at WVU. Until the results are in from this season, we won’t know.
Now, we’ve been debating, against what criteria do you rank them. Consider the following:.
Name: Career Record / Win % / SEC Record / SEC Win %
Brooks: 108-141 / 0.434 / 11-29 / 0.275
Croom: 17-30 / 0.362 / 8-24 / 0.250
Fulmer: 147-45 / 0.766 / 87-27 / 0.763
Johnson: 74-76 / 0.493 / 8-40 / 0.167
Meyer: 70-16 / 0.814 / 18-7 / 0.720
Miles: 62-27 / 0.697 / 20-6 / 0.769
Nutt: 111-70 / 0.613 / 42-38 / 0.525
Petrino: 41-9 / 0.820 / 0-0 / 0.000
Richt: 72-19 / 0.791 / 40-16 / 0.714
Saban: 99-48-1 / 0.717 / 34-16 / 0.680
Spurrier: 163-56-2 / 0.738 / 93-25 / 0.788
Tuberville: 105-53 / 0.665 / 62-44 / 0.585If you rank them based upon most wins, the list from best to worst looks like this:
Spurrier, Fulmer, Nutt, Brooks, Tuberville, Saban, Johnson, Richt, Meyer, Miles, Petrino, Croom
If you rank them based upon winning percentage you get this:
Petrino, Meyer, Richt, Fulmer, Spurrier, Saban, Miles, Tuberville, Nutt, Johnson, Brooks, Croom
Rank them based upon their records against the SEC and you get this:
Spurrier, Fulmer, Tuberville, Nutt, Richt, Saban, Miles, Meyer, Brooks, Croom, Johnson, Petrino
Finally (This is where I’ll stop…promise), rank them on SEC Win %:
Spurrier, Fulmer, Miles, Meyer, Richt, Saban, Tuberville, Nutt, Brooks, Croom, Johnson, Petrino
In every case selected, based upon the criteria selected, Saban only comes out 6th, and if you ranked the coaches as I had, based upon last year’s results (+ a couple “Zac” factors thrown in for giggles), Saban would be ranked below Croom. But, then again, so would Spurrier. At least in that case Saban would be in good company.
By the way, this is not meant to belittle anyone or their accomplishments. It is only meant to provide a different perspective.
TE
posted on April 14, 2008 8:55 AM — 70.180.43.182 — link — abuse? said:
Can't argue with Richt, though he evidently underachieved this past season, and he's also going to have to start the year with the target on his back. The only other time he's done that is in 2003. He returned a loaded team including guys like Pollack, Greene, Watson, and a stout defense coordinated by a brilliant Van Gorder...
They went 10-3, and got pasted twice by LSU, on the road and in a defacto home game for them in the Georgia Dome with the SEC on the line...
LSU averaged 30 points in two games against them that year.
Having said that, minus our starter, J-Russell, who got injured and was taken out of the game, Richt beat Miles & LSU in 2005. That was the year that we got our season rearranged and had to play 10 straight weeks due to the twin biatches, Katrina & Rita...
Other than that, Miles has beaten every coach ranked ahead of him, and did it this past year.
It's obvious with guys like Spurrier, Saban, Petrino, etc., you can't rank the coaches off of total wins, as a guy whose obviously past his prime like Fulmer ranks up top, where I think the consensus is that he simply does not belong.
You can't rank off of recruiting, either, Bleed Crimson...If we did, then Ron Zook & Mack Brown would be legendary, and Radio Zook would've never gotten run off from UF. Mack would also have way more than one title.
The problem with that is, they don't award any trophies for recruiting the #1 class. On top of that, Saban is universally considered a better coach than Zook, yet Zook went out and won 2 games, and then landed a Top 5 class, which is far more impressive in Champagne, Illinois, than Saban landing the #1 at Alabama in Tuscaloser.
My rankings
1A) Richt
1B) Miles
3.) Meyer
4.) Saban
5.) Tuberville
6.) Nutt
7.) Spurrier
8.) Fulmer
9.) Brooks
10.) Croom
11.) Petrino
12.) JohnsonMiles has played for two titles in 4 years, won two BCS Bowls, one BCS Championship, undefeated in Bowl Games, including a dismantling of a Top 10 Miami squad without JaMarcus Russell.
Richt doesn't have the resume, and that's simply due to the lack of a national title, and the fact that he plays in a cut-throat division.
Fulmer, Spurrier, & Tele-tubby have dropped off into the "Best Years are Behind Them" category, due to age and/or circumstance (the latter applying specifically to Tuberville with Saban's arrival in Tuscaloosa). Richt, Miles, Meyer & saban are going to dominate the conference the next few years. Nutt will make some noise, as well. I know some of you will make some catcalls over that, but the simple fact is that Nutt's going to make Ole Miss a winner. Not 10 wins a year and contending for the conference crown. But Ole Miss is going to begin flexing its muscle over guys like Arkansas & MSU...and that's enough for a winning record if you can snake a win here or there, and with your OOC slate.
Another interesting stat. We've got 4 former NFL Head Coaches. We've got 5 coaches who've won national championships in the BCS Era. Tuberville went undefeated and got the shaft, on top of that!
TampaGator said:
posted on April 14, 2008 11:30 AM — 64.12.116.136 — link — abuse?
Tomcat/#30:
"...[re.] Pitt's hire of Wannstedt...a couple of years ago....you would think he'd have no problem in the recruitment circles...In other words its probably not that he's getting outcoached, but that the others seem to find a way to motivate their players..."
Nah; that would be Charlie Weis at Notre Dame.
Wanstache is simply one of the worst coaches EVER to be appointed HC, anywhere.
Start with his tenure at the Miami Dolphins (his first HC position): in the year he had a healthy Ricky Wms, and Jason Taylor and Zach Thomas on D--they had the #1 running game and the #1 defense in the laugue...and somehow managed to miss the playoffs. The rest of the years they pretty much sucked--notwithstanding years of high draft pix.
At Pitt: the embarrasing game time futility has continued, save for the one game v. WVU last year--and he damn near snatched defeat from the jaws of victory in that one too.
In other words, he is getting outcoached big time, and you can expect more of that.
...and let us not forget that this is the same idiot who chased Dan Marino into retirement, referring to one of the all time greatest QB's ever, as "...that other guy"-essentially neglecting him in favor of Jay f$%n Fiddler.
I like Pitt--(my wife is Pitt alumnae). But Wanstache is just plain bad, at any level. You mentioned players atitude? Pay attention to his. Besides sucking as bad as he does, he somehow maintians this illusion that he is great....
...vain as the day is long....
Oh, and notice how Tyrell Pror was picked right out of his back yard--I don't know what kind of play Pitt (Wanstache) made for Pryor, but I'd bet it was pretty lame.
Just a hunch; I just don't see the 'stache, giving Pryor his due (probably too busy applying the brill cream)...
My $.02.
GO GATORS!!Tomcat said:
posted on April 14, 2008 12:53 PM — 69.154.247.65 — link — abuse?
#35 Thanks Tampagator I appreciate your imput.
This will probably be his last year and given the talent, there really is no reason that they cannot be sucessful.Guess this guy will probably be on the hot seat thread in the future.
Hookem-Horns
Adios Tomcat
AUtigerman said:
posted on April 14, 2008 3:27 PM — 129.61.46.60 — link — abuse?
TE cracks me up. He is so bias that he even puts Les Miles tied for first.
Since the writer broke this down into conferences
it seems to me we should look how they have done in the conference. Steve Spurrier 7th? how did you get that TE?
He took Florida from an also ran to a National powerhouse. His 82-12 SEC record is almost legendary.I just have a hard time seeing him anywhere but top 3 probably #1 on many list.
TE
posted on April 15, 2008 10:46 AM — 204.68.245.11 — link — abuse? said:
How I got that? Well, let's see...
Five of the six coaches on that list have won at least one (in Meyer & Saban's case, multiple) SEC Championship since Spurrier has (In Nutt's case, he's been to the SEC Championship Game twice since Spurrier's won it). Spurrier hasn't been a force to be reckoned with in this conference for the better part of the decade. He's finished below .500 in conference since his arrival in South Carolina, and his team doesn't show real signs of improvement.
Teams had about as much difficult running on South Carolina as Germany had with that pesky, plucky little European nation known as France during WWII.
He can't find consistency at quarterback, and the guy most thought would start is suspended for his 3rd alcohol-related suspension since he's been there (3rd arrest as well...Perrilloux's been arrested ZERO times, but its interesting how we don't hear Spurrier excoriated for allowing this kid the opportunity to get back on the team in the Fall?)...
Spurrier hasn't been a factor 'N Sync was still together...The coaches in front of him are all quite relavant, and in a certain sense, guys behind him (Brooks, Fulmer, Johnson, Croom, etc.) have been moreso or could be in the future than he has been since his return.
Steve Spurrier's tenure at USC is like New Coke, or Godfather Part III...Sometimes, you can't improve on perfection...
AUtigerman said:
posted on April 15, 2008 1:14 PM — 129.61.46.60 — link — abuse?
TE
Even the mighty Lou Holtz couldnt do much with South Carolina. I believe if Spurrier would have stayed in Florida hed still be top ranked.
Just dont think you can completely forget his accomplishments at Florida.
I could coach and win at Florida now with the talent they consistantly have gotten ever since Spurrier was there. He put that team on the map.
He has taken South Carolina to two bowl games in three years which isnt saying a whole lot but considering they seldom were bowl qualified thats got to mean something.
Consider this, USC all time record 521-523. Not very good id say.
Under Spurrier 21-16. With some pretty big wins along the way. Georgia, Clemson, Florida.Just my opinion
TE
posted on April 15, 2008 2:03 PM — 204.68.245.11 — link — abuse? said:
You just made my argument for me...You could win at Florida. Kristi Yamaguchi could win at Florida. Leona Helmsley's dog could win at Florida.
Spurrier won at Florida. But, at USC, he's merely average...
Compare him to a guy like Saban, whose...Wait...He's barely average so far at Bama, but you get the drift...He was way more compet...Wait...He lost five straight, too?
Well, he didn't lose to UL-Monr...Oh, wait...That was Bama that lost to them?
I guess my point is that we're ranking the coaches not based on lifetime achievement awards. We're ranking them based on how good we think they are, right now.
In the present.
AUtigerman said:
posted on April 15, 2008 7:34 PM — 68.1.99.173 — link — abuse?
Well i guess you missed my point.
Point being if it wasnt for Spurrier putting Florida on the map i dont think anyone after him would have been as successful as they have been.Also noone has ever won much at USC.
Let Spurrier take an LSU team built by Nick Saban and im pretty sure results would have been the same as they have been for Lesticles.
Way more talent to be had at LSU then SC.
Im not even sure why im defending the schumck but i think hes much better then you have him ranked.
Big Tide said:
posted on April 16, 2008 8:28 PM — 12.208.88.211 — link — abuse?
AUTigerman #42 Best Post This Year!!! You'll never get the Florida or LSU fans to get their heads out of the clouds. If Florida was so damn special why did they suck Hind Tit for so long. Same with LSU. Give Spurrier some credit!! Give Saban some credit!! Don't take your recent success for granted, because as Bama fans know - all success is fleeting...
And TE, I know you like to stir the pot but "Saban at Alabama is barely average." The man has had one season. That statement is so ignorant as to defy logic......
Regan said:
posted on April 17, 2008 5:39 AM — 75.182.53.208 — link — abuse?
Big Tide (#43):
There are (apparently) few people nowadays that understand the meaning of 'sucking hind tit' nowadays. My dad grew up on the farm in rural SC and went to Clemson; he uses the expression occasionally so I know its meaning.
However, your use of the phrase was fairly accurate and darned funny. :-)
OU Fan said:
posted on April 17, 2008 6:12 AM — 139.139.51.70 — link — abuse?
In my opinion, any good football coach who knows how to coach to win can produce good results with the Louisiana State football program. LSU year after year is loaded with talent. Every highly talented football player in the state of Louisiana from what I noticed dreams of playing football for LSU so in turn, LSU doesn't have a hard time with bringing in good recruits. Les Miles is a good football coach and the fact that his team won a BCS national championsip proves it, but the quality of talent on that football team was the largest contributor. Les Miles' overall record as OSU was 28-21. Oklahoma State gets no way near the quality of talent that LSU gets but Miles did what he could with what he had. The point I am trying to make is that the quality of talent will define a teams success. Yeah, any national title bound team needs good coaching, but the talented players are the guys on the field, not the coach. My opinion of the ol ball Coach is that he is a good football coach. He took Flordia to a national championship. Bob Stoops worked for him. I'm sure Spurrier could win another championship if South Carolina had the quality of talent that Florida gets. But thats just not the case. I also think Alabama will win at least 8, probably 9 games this year. However, if I was a Bama fan I would just hope the JPW can get the rock to his receivers. I'm not saying the kid sucks, I'm just saying his accuracy is not too great from when I watched him in action. Its like the kid has an on/off switch for when he'll have a good game. Just my opinion. BOOMER!
AUtigerman said:
posted on April 17, 2008 6:40 PM — 68.1.99.173 — link — abuse?
Big Tide
I was trying to make the point that coaches do make a huge difference especially at the college level.
To put Spurrier Saban or even Tubberville lower then either Meyer or Miles just shows bias. Longevity is what counts. Both inherited great programs and great athelets. Both will show they are mediocre and begin to slide soon. Meyer showed that last year.This could be Miles year
And for TE to say that Tubbs best years are behind him is silly. He must not know that he is at least good enough to realize he had to change things up a bit.
Im not going to say much about Auburn 2008 chances because i like the fact that we are under the radar a bit. But i will say this. We havent lost to LSU at home in a looong time. And the winner of that game usually contends for the west title. See you on the plains TE
Zac said:
posted on April 18, 2008 2:09 AM — 205.188.116.136 — link — abuse?
OU-Fan, I like the point you bring out in Post 45. ANY "good" coach, if given the talent can be successful. The great coaches are those who not only know how to guide their troops on the field, they're good recruiters, good teachers, good listeners, good motivators; they inspire their players to play above themselves, and they lead by example.
Now, I never thought I would be wasting time by giving Rich Rodriguez props. BUT, ya gotta admit; there was a man who did very well with less than most. This past recruiting class is the 1st I've seen at WVU which contains a half dozen 4 & 5 Star recruits. Prior to that, WVU would be lucky to see as many as 2 in a recruiting class. The vast majority of starters and key back-ups on Rich Rod's teams were 1, 2, & 3 Star players; not to mention, a passel of walk-ons. Needless to say, he did very well with what he had.
Rodriguez is far from the only one who's managed success with much less. When you consider coaches like Fisher DeBerry (succeeded by Troy Calhoun), Lavell Edwards (succeeded by Crowton & Mendenhall), Jim Grobe, Paul Johnson, Mike Leach, Jim Leavitt, George O'Leary, Gary Patterson, Howard Schnellenberger, Ron Zook, to name a few, these men have garnered success in spite of the shortcomings of their teams.
It can't be easy to coach at the academies, let alone draw talent there. The same argument can be made for most private schools. Yet, they did the best they could with what they had. Sure, some did very well at programs where talent was prominent, but they also managed to do respectably where talent was in short supply. It would be interesting to see everyone's views of coaches with winning records, at so called "lesser programs".
OU Fan said:
posted on April 18, 2008 5:15 PM — 84.146.42.164 — link — abuse?
Thanks Zac. Since I don't follow WVU football, I know nothing as to how many juniors and seniors the Neers will have next season so I can't really comment on them. What I do know is that Pat White returns to lead their offense. I would love to see an OU-WVU rematch although its very unlikely to happen. I will be rooting for WVU against Auburn but even though I have no passion whatsoever for the Colorado Buffaloes, I'm going to have to pull for the Big 12 on that one. Heres to West Virginia beating Auburn this year. I would love to see some SEC teams lose in out of conference games this upcoming season. BOOMER!!
AUtigerman said:
posted on April 19, 2008 4:23 PM — 68.1.99.173 — link — abuse?
OU FanSeems every one that isnt an SEC fan pulls for them to lose non conference games. So your not alone in pulling against Auburn.
Im glad to see SEC is stepping up with some big non conference games this year.
Id love to see Auburn pull off the upset at Morgan town . West Virginia is a quality team with quality fans. Should be a lot of fun.
OU sure looks to be a though one to beat this year.
Im thinking OU with Texas and Kansas at home could run the table.I think OSU and OU both have a good chance to run the table next year.
Tomcat said:
posted on April 19, 2008 4:47 PM — 69.153.82.144 — link — abuse?
#50 AUtigerman I'm glad that some teams have scheduled tough opponents for non-conference games. WV vs AU sounds like a good one and I personally dont have any preference as to the outcome. I'm kinda glad that yall got the Buffs next year, good luck, here again, dont really care guess I'll pull for AU to beat WV-sorry Zac and pull for CU ( A team we hate) to beat AU because we travel to Boulder next year.
They all sound like sound good games and I dont think the Horns will run up 73 points on the Buffs like last time. This is alot younger team and the Horns are playing up there[ hostile enviroment].
OU is a tough opponent every year, but I really dont think any team from the XII is going run the table or emerge undefeated next year.
BTW OU being the home team in the RRS game, just means that UT will wear the white uniforms and nothing else. Its actually a road game for both teams, with the crowd split 50/50.
What do you think about
OU vs TCU
OU vs TTech ??
Hookem-HornsAUtigerman said:
posted on April 19, 2008 5:47 PM — 68.1.99.173 — link — abuse?
Tomcat
I didnt realize you played OU on neutral ground (if you call cotton bowl neutral)
I think that will be OUs biggest test and almost wrote that before. Muschamp is a great coach and will turn your D around. Which is all Texas seems to lack right now.I hate that he left AU but he wont be at Texas a real long time either. He will be a head coach before to long.
I just looked at the OU schedule and thought they had a great chance. Im hoping for no undefeated teams because i dont see any SEC team including Auburn going unscathed.
I predict AU to go 10-2 and win the west of SEC this year,and for Tubberville to win coach of the year....pretty bold thinking.
Tomcat said:
posted on April 19, 2008 9:10 PM — 70.242.184.57 — link — abuse?
#52 AUtigerman Yes its as neutral as you can get. Dallas is about halfway between Norman OK and Austin Tx. The tickets are split between the two schools 50-50. One end zone is red and the other Burnt orange.Go to wikipedia and check out some photos.The Red River Shootout has been played in Dallas for like 60 years or something.
In fact Texas fans used to call the Big-8 conference Oklahoma & the seven dwarfs.
Hookem-Horns
BTW Its a sick & Twisted rivalry with a long history
Adios TomcatZac said:
posted on April 20, 2008 3:05 AM — 205.188.116.136 — link — abuse?
Tomcat, like Autigerman, I'm stoked about this year's WVU schedule as well, which includes a trip to Boulder 3 games before the home stand against Auburn. (BTW, no sweat as to who you pick to win.) I think my Mountaineers will make it out of Boulder alive, but I'm certain the Buffs will show them where their hearts are.
The Auburn game, on the other hand, is as tough to call as can be imagined. Auburn is expected to have a solid defense, despite of the loss of Muschamp, but they're working in a new QB. WVU is expected to have a solid offense despite the loss of Rodriguez & Magee, but they're working in new CB's & D-Line. It's gonna come down to who executes their game plan better. I'm just grateful it's in Morgantown, because right now, it's a wash.
I'll tell you this, if WVU comes out of this season with a 10-2 record, I think Mr. Dienhart will have to rate Stewart up a little higher on his B.E. list.
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OU-Ron
said:
posted on April 8, 2008 11:46 AM — 216.201.209.146 — link — abuse?Here’s my choice in the BigXll
1) Stoops Just win a Bowl game
2) Brown Problem--Stoops
3) Leach Getting better and better
4) Pinkel Has Chase another year
5) Mangino Could move up
6) Pelini will be 4th or 5th next year
7) Hawkins This year will tell
8) Gundy ??????????
9) Prince Beat Texas twice
10) Chizik Not much to work with
11) Sherman unknown
12) Briles unknown
Briles and Sherman could be higher, I’ll wait until they play in the conference a year or two…..